Disallowing gang alliances

[Liam]

Gangs should not be making alliances to overpower the LSPS or bully other gangs, it makes no sense. Majority of the gangs on the server have been at war a fair few times then all of a sudden they're allied and dominate the server. It doesn't make sense in RP, it feels very unrealistic.

Gangs don't even care when the LSPS arrive on a situation, they continue shooting in their OWN personal car, screaming down the radio with no fear factor that they could be shot, caught and sentenced to life for numerous murders. In a real life scenario, most gangs would scatter as soon as they heard police arriving or seen them so that they aren't caught but the most I've heard when arriving is - 

"Police won't do shit, keep shooting"

In reality, a gang wouldn't mess with the police as they know that they'll just get fucked by the police. This also counts as locking down hospitals with their massive weapons on display, attacking a PD. Majority of the real life situations of police stations being attacked are either in movies in the US and IN THE US. We shouldn't make the police overpowered and I understand it is a game but gangs shouldn't treat police as vending machines nor as pets.

I have played both sides before anyone comes in here criticising that I only main Police, that would be wrong. I don't see the need for gangs to team up to overpower a gang or the Police. Gangs have a max cap of 25? I RARELY see 20 cops on at the one time. The fact that gangs are dominating the server and overpowering Police so that we aren't capable of doing anything is horrendous. It not only makes is extremely unfair but it doesn't give us the motivation to play.

I was told a few weeks ago that two gangs were fighting each other and as soon as Police arrived to you know POLICE THE SITUATION as that's what they do, these two gangs just stopped fighting each other and both started shooting the police, how does that make sense? It doesn't. Someone being married from a rival gang shouldn't just make all gang feuds end and all the history of these gangs fighting to just disappear, it cuts off even more RP.

Sure you could say some of these alliances came from a strong standpoint in RP such as two individuals from different gangs marrying each other in RP, well another suggestion could be actual server rules in place to stop gangs circumventing the Gang cap of 25 and not involving themselves in the other gangs feuds.

 

[aqnr]

People are still trying to avoid looking into the future and present. As someone who currently doesn't have gang affiliation in RP, I believe that it makes sense to have alliances but to an extent where I don't think that there should be a group of 50 people going everywhere just because they can. Like I've said on another post I think that there MUST be a limit of how many people are allowed to be together at a time, this should include everything and anything that the group will be doing, unless if there's a party or a public/private meeting place.

 

[Dazz]

-1 Don't really see an issue with it if I'm being honest, we're being social and creating RP between gangs because lets face it there is fuck all else to do in the server and any time you try create RP with a majority of players they shut you down instantly have had this happen to me on many occasions and even by members of staff in the past and any RP that has been provided has been poor quality.

A lot of people are unhappy about Triads and Ballas having relations whilst being two separate gangs but seen no issues when 4 gangs teamed up on Vagos and Apostles or seen no issues with the countless amounts of other gangs having relationships "AzBallas, AzPostles, Tragos" have all been fine but as soon as its two other gangs that have valid RP to have an alliance its all of a sudden not fine and not enjoyable? 

Gang merging is obviously something that has recently become a thing in the server but the cons outweigh the pros for other gangs just because Apostles and Aztecas had a good relationship before hand and are now "1" and enjoy it does not mean it will be the same for other gangs if they chose to participate in this new "meta".

Would also like to point out that you say gangs say "police won't do anything keep shooting" which is true because countless amounts of times police intervene mid shoot out with little to no RP and value of life to try get the guns from dead bodies or to arrest people which makes no sense to me. You are running into a gang fight against Revolvers, AKs and Uzis and expect to not get killed because its your job? Doesn't seem very professional to me from a police standpoint.

Roleplay standards in the server have dropped significantly the past few months to the point where most people are just coming on to make money to show off cars so enjoy the little sparks of RP that we are trying to create whilst you have it because when its gone I doubt there will be many other attempts of creating scenarios that aren't just two dimensional conversations that are forgotten about a few seconds later. 

We need to focus on Roleplay in the server as a whole rather than "I'm not having fun because there are too many people here" as logging onto the server is becoming a unenjoyable for a lot of people as we log on speak to each other and log off because as previously mentioned the standards seem to have dropped majorly as no one has the drive they used to due to newer players not showing any level of enthusiasm and just want to buy cars and weapons and older players are seeing the same revolving door of people asking the same questions therefore making everyday feel like ground hog day.

 

[Coozer]

In the recent fight at the church triads had 16 members present, im not sure why people keep saying we roll 50 man deep when we physically cant, in triad F6 we only have 21 members as you can see here  so in order For Triads to roll 50 deep ballas would need to have 29 members, i understand the alliance we have with Ballas is a very strong one however we have not used it to bully anyone, the fights TriadxBallas have been in has had multiple gangs involved.


The first church push. TriadxBallas VS Aztecas,apostles ,Grove (2v3)

2 days ago when we pushed the church again yes the Coalition are now RPing as one gang however its still all new and kinda confusing, especially when you have members referring to themself as  Aztecas and apostles still. thats the only reason we went to help as we was under the impression it was a 2v1 gang fight. 

Later that night Coalition,229,padrinos pushed Triad turf after we (gang leaders) sat in TS for about an hr discussing where to go from earlier in the day, i thought we was leaving it at that clearly i was wrong.

Yesterday Coalition,229,padrinos,Marabunta all went against TriadxBallas fair enough we had 3 members of lost helping as they didn't want to see the entire server vs us however i don't believe we asked for their help they just offered.

I can promise you when Triads went down to grove it was ONLY Triads not a single member of ANY other gang was present. 


Myself and Sean said when starting this alliance it would only be used to ensure a gang never felt bullied or didn't want to play anymore.

Are you all forgetting when it was the entire server VS Triad alone? We didn't take it to the forums or kick up a fuss OOC, No we made our bed and lay in it we fought back and held our own. But ill ask now to the old gang leaders at that time Jack Mckenzie&Mason where was this post then? it wasn't an issue when you were in our position.

FYI i didn't mention other leads in the last part of my post as i think Jambo and Kyle were leading at that time. 

 

 

[Liam]

-1 Don't really see an issue with it if I'm being honest, we're being social and creating RP between gangs because lets face it there is fuck all else to do in the server and any time you try create RP with a majority of players they shut you down instantly have had this happen to me on many occasions and even by members of staff in the past and any RP that has been provided has been poor quality.

It's a roleplay server, you can create roleplay on the server so the "nothing to do on the server" argument isn't really valid imo.

Would also like to point out that you say gangs say "police won't do anything keep shooting" which is true because countless amounts of times police intervene mid shoot out with little to no RP and value of life to try get the guns from dead bodies or to arrest people which makes no sense to me. You are running into a gang fight against Revolvers, AKs and Uzis and expect to not get killed because its your job? Doesn't seem very professional to me from a police standpoint.

It doesn't make sense to you for the police to intervene a potential terrorist organisation from shooting up the streets of Los Santos? The British Police are the first standpoint when there is an alleged terrorist threat. I'd say thats more than professional to intervene and stop the numerous murders taking place rather than standing there collecting evidence.

Roleplay standards in the server have dropped significantly the past few months to the point where most people are just coming on to make money to show off cars so enjoy the little sparks of RP that we are trying to create whilst you have it because when its gone I doubt there will be many other attempts of creating scenarios that aren't just two dimensional conversations that are forgotten about a few seconds later. 

This is true, its dropped from both sides.

In the recent fight at the church triads had 16 members present, im not sure why people keep saying we roll 50 man deep when we physically cant, in triad F6 we only have 21 members as you can see here View attachment 18319 so in order For Triads to roll 50 deep ballas would need to have 29 members, i understand the alliance we have with Ballas is a very strong one however we have not used it to bully anyone, the fights TriadxBallas have been in has had multiple gangs involved.

It was a rough assumption due to the sheer amount of gang members present.

Yesterday Coalition,229,padrinos,Marabunta all went against TriadxBallas fair enough we had 3 members of lost helping as they didn't want to see the entire server vs us however i don't believe we asked for their help they just offered. 

I'm sure "The Coalition" only brought more gangs to the war due to it being Triads and Ballas present.

I can promise you when Triads went down to grove it was ONLY Triads not a single member of ANY other gang was present. 

PJ Adams has already admitted to being present.

Are you all forgetting when it was the entire server VS Triad alone? We didn't take it to the forums or kick up a fuss OOC, No we made our bed and lay in it we fought back and held our own. But ill ask now to the old gang leaders at that time Jack Mckenzie&Mason where was this post then? it wasn't an issue when you were in our position

No-one is disputing that, every Triad and Ballas member thinks that this post has been put up purely due to the war with The Coalition, Ballas and Triads, when its an overall suggestion due to the Police and also the gangs that are being overpowered and that it doesn't make sense from an RP standpoint, a gang would not be able to overpower the police .

 

[Cal]

-1, as a lot of people have stated alliances between gangs have been a thing throughout my months in this community. Alliances are made and some are broken I have to say responses seem very contradictory to what I have seen happen on the server. If the removal of alliances happens I believe it will have a negative effect on the server. If you want both your gangs to merge, great that's your decision but you cant then expect allies to cut all ties off with each other.

 

[Bmav]

I can promise you when Triads went down to grove it was ONLY Triads not a single member of ANY other gang was present. 



 

PJ admitted to being there on TS when bobby delta thought he got shot by him...

 

[Dazz]

It doesn't make sense to you for the police to intervene a potential terrorist organisation from shooting up the streets of Los Santos? The British Police are the first standpoint when there is an alleged terrorist threat. I'd say thats more than professional to intervene and stop the numerous murders taking place rather than standing there collecting evidence.

Not when you're heavily outnumbered and outgunned mate it just makes it look like police are bored and need something to do and a lot of the time nothing comes of it, guns are taken from gang members and the only repercussion is that they are out of pocket and sometimes fined. This isn't a discussion about police vs gangs as that conversation is had pretty much daily in some way shape or form but just wanted to comment on it as I you brought it up and know that you play your police character a lot.

It's a roleplay server, you can create roleplay on the server so the "nothing to do on the server" argument isn't really valid imo.

I'd love to do this but as I stated and as you have agreed with the standards have dropped and a lot of people can't be assed anymore mate which is really unfortunate to see as I used to love logging on every day and spending my time creating interesting and meaningful situations but it just doesn't happen anymore as everyone is grinding money or just don't know how to respond with their minimal experience. 

 

[Bmav]

From all the replies here from ballas and triads it seems everyone is fine with the alliance so should we just continue and every other gang ally against triads and ballas because thats how the RP was going towards.

It works both ways you started wars 24/7 against everyone in the city it's not a surprise everyone gets united against a common enemy, at least we ally for only one thing and don't go around flexing our alliance like we are just one big gang. (Saying hypothetically) 

 

[Dazz]

If it's not fair having two gangs worth of resources then merge with the Ballas, no one is stopping you.

This wouldn't have any effect as the two gangs worth of resources would still be present just stored in one place

 

[Liam]

 know that you play your police character a lot.

That's debatable, I've barely clocked 10 hours this month.

Not when you're heavily outnumbered and outgunned mate it just makes it look like police are bored and need something to do and a lot of the time nothing comes of it, guns are taken from gang members and the only repercussion is that they are out of pocket and sometimes fined. This isn't a discussion about police vs gangs as that conversation is had pretty much daily in some way shape or form but just wanted to comment on it as I you brought it up and know that you play your police character a lot.

Majority of the time we've been told to stay out of it and collect evidence for CID, then other times [GANG NAME] members have willing opened fire on police, I.E Massive Chapel gunfight, At Vagos etc. You can shift the blame of police are "bored" and looking for something to do, we are the Police. We have to police criminals shooting up streets. I don't see how that is the police's fault that you worked hard for a weapon that you've used openly and willingly in front of the police then are upset that you have lost it. That is the name of the gun, this is essentially a cops vs robbers simulator in the most previous months.

 

[iSky0]

I agree it's unrealistic for two big powerful gangs to gang up against a gang and/or police, it's very powerful but if we want to talk about power, there are things police are way too powerful at that needs reducing. Point still stands everytime a gunshot dispatch goes through, we are not to attend because outnumbered, obviously cant go on police discord and tell people to wake up unless gangs do it, but when things like these happen i feel like shootouts are the most fun that can be had and we as police cant attend it which sucks due to the alliances.

But lets not mix up between "alliances" and gang's enemies, It could not be an alliance, it just could be gang A has beef with C, and at the same time, B has beef with C.

I just want to get involved in more fun, police cant attend a shootout, police get robbed by randoms 24/7, realistically the police should be way more respected and feared. But i guess im going a bit off-topic as this topic is specific to gang alliances against other gangs especially, and police partially, i personally didnt see triads and ballas against police at the same time.

 

[Dazz]

From all the replies here from ballas and triads it seems everyone is fine with the alliance so should we just continue and every other gang ally against triads and ballas because thats how the RP was going towards.

It works both ways you started wars 24/7 against everyone in the city it's not a surprise everyone gets united against a common enemy, at least we ally for only one thing and don't go around flexing our alliance like we are just one big gang. (Saying hypothetically) 

We did not start a 24/7 war we hit the chapel and awaited retaliation, whilst waiting for this other gangs were contacted to get involved which would mean it would have been a larger scale battle than it needed to be. However if there is a valid RP reason for this to happen then fair enough lets see what happens gives us something interesting to do for a while  before RP gets back on track, everyone hates us and wants to target us which is how Aztecas were treated up until their relationship with Ballas where they had someone to back them up.

 

[Bmav]

We did not start a 24/7 war we hit the chapel and awaited retaliation, whilst waiting for this other gangs were contacted to get involved which would mean it would have been a larger scale battle than it needed to be. However if there is a valid RP reason for this to happen then fair enough lets see what happens gives us something interesting to do for a while  before RP gets back on track, everyone hates us and wants to target us which is how Aztecas were treated up until their relationship with Ballas where they had someone to back them up.

Yhe you hit the chapel in retaliation and one day before that you hit grove because of a situation that happened 1 month ago at the other chapel fight that was supposedly solved at the sanctuary.

You can't complain if everyone goes against you xd when you spin a wheel daily to see who you gonna start a war with.

 

[Dazz]

Majority of the time we've been told to stay out of it and collect evidence for CID, then other times [GANG NAME] members have willing opened fire on police, I.E Massive Chapel gunfight, At Vagos etc. You can shift the blame of police are "bored" and looking for something to do, we are the Police. We have to police criminals shooting up streets. I don't see how that is the police's fault that you worked hard for a weapon that you've used openly and willingly in front of the police then are upset that you have lost it. That is the name of the gun, this is essentially a cops vs robbers simulator in the most previous months.

That's how it should be collecting evidence for a raid or on warrants for individual members that would create an scenario in which both parties are able to participate and have an enjoyable time creating RP between the two groups  (Depending on who it is being raided the dynamic would create a lot of RP) as for Police being shot during gunfights I have only seen on occasion when police try to push/intervene I myself haven't open fire on police without initiating within RP as I can't be assed dealing with a report that is easily avoidable. 

Yhe you hit the chapel in retaliation and one day before that you hit grove because of a situation that happened 1 month ago at the other chapel fight that was supposedly solved at the sanctuary.

You can't complain if everyone goes against you xd when you spin a wheel daily to see who you gonna start a war with.

I didn't hit Grove so your comment about that is irrelevant.

And at no time did I complain about it because I enjoy gun fights as much as the next person due to it giving me something interesting to do.

 

[Liam]

That's how it should be collecting evidence for a raid or on warrants for individual members that would create an scenario in which both parties are able to participate and have an enjoyable time creating RP between the two groups  (Depending on who it is being raided the dynamic would create a lot of RP) as for Police being shot during gunfights I have only seen on occasion when police try to push/intervene I myself haven't open fire on police without initiating within RP as I can't be assed dealing with a report that is easily avoidable. 

So, you'd want the police to ignore all threat life that is currently on going in front of them to acquire bodycam footage that would not be used as all cars in the gunfight that drives around are owned by numerous sets of people, you're all wearing masks, we can't identify by voice, so that renders the body cam footage pointless and insufficient evidence than intervening in a gunfight and getting a few [GANG NAME] to stop shooting at each other, whilst scooping them up and charging them for said charge and taking a gun off the street?

This is going off topic, lets remain on topic with the original post, if you have nothing more to say on the matter you aren't required to keep commenting.

 

[Bobby_Delta]

-1

Its funny how most of the people that react here where all in the same spots. When they had there alliances and it went good for them you didn't hear them complain about it and now suddenly its a big problem.

It’s a big problem when 4 gangs go against 2 and then it becomes a peace you and  ballas think you can run full c city and it doesn’t work like that there is no rp involved at all so plus +1 get rid of all alliances 

 

[Dazz]

So, you'd want the police to ignore all threat life that is currently on going in front of them to acquire bodycam footage that would not be used as all cars in the gunfight that drives around are owned by numerous sets of people, you're all wearing masks, we can't identify by voice, so that renders the body cam footage pointless and insufficient evidence than intervening in a gunfight and getting a few [GANG NAME] to stop shooting at each other, whilst scooping them up and charging them for said charge and taking a gun off the street?

This is going off topic, lets remain on topic with the original post, if you have nothing more to say on the matter you aren't required to keep commenting.

The threat of life is only to the gang members who are actively involved anyone who is sitting about watching is on them as they are not valuing their lives I have seen a plethora of staff announcements telling people to disperse but chose not to which should end up in them getting kicked from the server to actually enforce that rule similar to that of loitering (Or adjust the rule of loitering to big fights too)

Also in regards to voice IDing people not being allowed that cant be true as every time I get arrested or I am out of colours with a mask on I still get called by my name in cells because of my voice, which has also happened to me when I am on different characters.

I agree we are having a separate conversation here and need to get back to the topic at hand appreciate your time though mate and this will be the last comment I make in regards to an off topic conversation. 

 

[Steph]

I think someone mentioned this already but I feel as that, depending on the situation, there should be exceptions as to when gangs should or shouldn't team up against police. At the end of the day you won't ever satisfy both sites, someone will always be left behind with a sour taste in their mouth and judging by what I've seen there been multiple instances where both gangs AND police provided low RP and displayed some form of "winning mentality" - which I know it shouldn't, but can happen when you bring together multiple people with different mindsets and playstyles. I just think that atm both police and gangs tend to be very biased towards their own interests which leads to RP scenarios not being able to properly being played out. Once again I can only stretch that this is an issue that involves BOTH sides. You are all cheeky little fuckers.  

About the gang alliances.. I feel that this is a subject that should have been addressed a long time ago but only is now because certain situations gained some traction which caused tension to be high. At the end of the day there always have been alliances and in pretty much all cases (except a few) they have been used to "defeat" another party and in most situations they've been unpleasant for the other gangs. I don't think this is just an BallasXTriads (not excusing their behaviour/their wrongs) issue but due to the current circumstances they are under fire for it. If people are honest, and you know who you are I won't name drop, then most of you did enjoy alliances in those situations where they benefited YOU and I am most certain most of you didn't bother how it felt for the other side - which I think is fine and nothing too terrible. It happens so fast and it's not always easy to put yourself in someone else's position, at the end of the day who doesn't enjoy "winning" or "being on top" or whatever you may want to call it. But I know for a fact that a lot of people, from a lot of different gangs, enjoyed it when they "smoked" their enemies together. I think instead of pointing the finger, naming and shaming, plotting revenge or arguing, maybe gang leads and staff should sit together and work out a way or a set of rules in which alliances can work without bringing too much trouble and drama into the city. I personally liked @Jack Mckenzieidea of holding Gangs to the same standard as the Lost MC for example. Those could all be possible ideas being discussed by the leaders. But all this arguing here is pointless and a little bit fake too because most people don't hold themselves to the same standard they are expecting of others. 

 

[FrooGames]

-1 

Personally I think this is stupid as there was no Issue when Azballas were a thing over powering and teaming up on the Vagos. Not to mention Hustlers used to be also teamed and helping them push just Vagos alone. 

You keep saying 50+ members are involved but there isn't yesterday there were no more than 20 people being a mix of Triads and Ballas and when it got later in the evening maybe another 5-10 woke up and got involved. 

Personally I think the police should be over powered by the gangs as gangs you should all hate the police. Look at the Vagos and Grove War recently Police were to involved so instead of fighting each other they switched their sights and started fighting the police together. That is how it should be the Gangs should team against the police because that is how the gangs mentality has always been and should be against police IMO. 

Not really sure why this is even needed as a vote TBH. 

 

[Liam]

This is going off topic, lets remain on topic with the original post, if you have nothing more to say on the matter you aren't required to keep commenting.