Disallowing gang alliances

[Liam]

Gangs should not be making alliances to overpower the LSPS or bully other gangs, it makes no sense. Majority of the gangs on the server have been at war a fair few times then all of a sudden they're allied and dominate the server. It doesn't make sense in RP, it feels very unrealistic.

Gangs don't even care when the LSPS arrive on a situation, they continue shooting in their OWN personal car, screaming down the radio with no fear factor that they could be shot, caught and sentenced to life for numerous murders. In a real life scenario, most gangs would scatter as soon as they heard police arriving or seen them so that they aren't caught but the most I've heard when arriving is - 

"Police won't do shit, keep shooting"

In reality, a gang wouldn't mess with the police as they know that they'll just get fucked by the police. This also counts as locking down hospitals with their massive weapons on display, attacking a PD. Majority of the real life situations of police stations being attacked are either in movies in the US and IN THE US. We shouldn't make the police overpowered and I understand it is a game but gangs shouldn't treat police as vending machines nor as pets.

I have played both sides before anyone comes in here criticising that I only main Police, that would be wrong. I don't see the need for gangs to team up to overpower a gang or the Police. Gangs have a max cap of 25? I RARELY see 20 cops on at the one time. The fact that gangs are dominating the server and overpowering Police so that we aren't capable of doing anything is horrendous. It not only makes is extremely unfair but it doesn't give us the motivation to play.

I was told a few weeks ago that two gangs were fighting each other and as soon as Police arrived to you know POLICE THE SITUATION as that's what they do, these two gangs just stopped fighting each other and both started shooting the police, how does that make sense? It doesn't. Someone being married from a rival gang shouldn't just make all gang feuds end and all the history of these gangs fighting to just disappear, it cuts off even more RP.

Sure you could say some of these alliances came from a strong standpoint in RP such as two individuals from different gangs marrying each other in RP, well another suggestion could be actual server rules in place to stop gangs circumventing the Gang cap of 25 and not involving themselves in the other gangs feuds.

 

[Bmav]

i was on a firearms ride along at the time. The whole time before they finally shot police they kept shouting "this doesnt include police leave" rp it involves us and then moan when we start taking them to hospital saying we baited the fight. Gangs seem to forget whay rp is when there is gang wars. Recently with 229 vs triad and ballas its been shit for both police and civi. I fot robbed as my civi for no reason but "we think your 229" with nothing to show. and as police had triads and ballas over 30 or 40 rob a officer because someone was voluntary turning their weapon in.

If you wanna fight with them make 1 gang. Thats the whole point of the gang cap to stop 30 gang members vs 6 firearms officers. not for a gang to spilt over 2 and never separate

I completely agree that gangs shouldn't just all be together at the same compound and pretend like they are one huge gang,  When grove and Vagos had their war recently we only fought against cops when cops started shooting, telling people from both sides to put their hands up or to break people out from both sides (basically both gangs had to be threatened by cops in that same situation, and they would go against cops)  which were valid reasons but fighting together 24/7 against everyone and even rob police together just because why not makes, no sense.

 

[PinkSprinkles]

-1. Every gang has alliances in and out of war regardless of the situation. There is plenty of RP to be had with alliances and would just remove ANOTHER aspect that gangs in the server can have control of.

 

[Liam]

-1, I really really fail to understand why this needs implementation, IRL gangs will ally over situations over countless different reasons. Wars, Businesses, Mutual Agreements. Taking this away from the city will just be the nail in the coffin for gang growth and gameplay.

Find me any proof of gangs that team up together to take over a city.

-1

Its funny how most of the people that react here where all in the same spots. When they had there alliances and it went good for them you didn't hear them complain about it and now suddenly its a big problem.

I've been involved with Gang alliances before, but the current meta with Triads and Ballas having an alliance is absurd and completely overpowers any and all people who try to intervene, its not only unfair but unrealistic.

-1. Every gang has alliances in and out of war regardless of the situation. There is plenty of RP to be had with alliances and would just remove ANOTHER aspect that gangs in the server can have control of.

"Remove another aspect that gangs in the server can have control of"? What was removed from gangs before?

All and all, you're circumventing the gang cap to completely decimate other gangs and the Police. 

 

[Chuck Greenhorn]

-1, Love how the people that are reacting, didn't say ANYTHING when they had an alliance and did the exact same thing

 

[Bmav]

-1

Its funny how most of the people that react here where all in the same spots. When they had there alliances and it went good for them you didn't hear them complain about it and now suddenly its a big problem.

Who ? Aztecas and Apostles actually united to make it fair, and they are a 25 gang when they joined into the coalition its not their fault that when they get 2 gangs on them that they ask from back up from other people.

If

What i can't understand is you doing a 2 vs 1 and when every gang has had enough of ballas and triads being together against everyone and 2 vs 1 almost every gang and those gangs all unite against 1 common enemy because it makes sense they get complained at.

Anyway's i don't think people should be calling out on specific things but considering you had to mention it it's only fair it gets answered.

If you want to have triads and ballas allied might aswell prepare to have every single gang against you to see if you enjoy the same that other gangs have been dealing with.

 

[Masis]

Who ? Aztecas and Apostles actually united to make it fair, and they are a 25 gang when they joined into the coalition its not their fault that when they get 2 gangs on them that they ask from back up from other people.

If

What i can't understand is you doing a 2 vs 1 and when every gang has had enough of ballas and triads being together against everyone and 2 vs 1 almost every gang and those gangs all unite against 1 common enemy because it makes sense they get complained at.

Anyway's i don't think people should be calling out on specific things but considering you had to mention it it's only fair it gets answered.

Ballas and Triads do not 2v1 other gangs, we have always fought our induvidual fights (for example, Triads vs Hustlers and Ballas vs Grove) as far as I know, the Coalition still have their seperate gang rosters, safehoues & safe's they can all still access. 

Anytime during our Alliance if one of us was at war, we always communicated with each other that we want the 1v1 but if the enemy decides to get a third party involved, so will we.

(Not a staff opinion, just wanted to point that out that's all )

 

[Readshaw95]

-1, its seems again that because people have formed one gang they want every other gang to end their alliance but when they had their alliance wasn't an issue it just seems that once people realise how powerful people can be they seem to cry, moving to police it just seems that they don't want gangs at all again because when they lose a situation it damages their ego but its different when police that don't lose anything when losing a gun, but when police constantly hit gangs for example they raided triads like 3 times in 2 months, you should be able to ask allies for help and stand up for each other, for me removing alliances would just finish off gangs completely and kill most experiences for gang members. 

 

[Mr Tate]

Find me any proof of gangs that team up together to take over a city.

I've been involved with Gang alliances before, but the current meta with Triads and Ballas having an alliance is absurd and completely overpowers any and all people who try to intervene, its not only unfair but unrealistic.

"Remove another aspect that gangs in the server can have control of"? What was removed from gangs before?

All and all, you're circumventing the gang cap to completely decimate other gangs and the Police. 

Who said we teamed up to take over the city?, we have allied as we both had 1 common enemy mainly. When triads had issues with grove, we was not involved, whenever we had a problem with another gang, they was not involved.

 

[Jet]

Who ? Aztecas and Apostles actually united to make it fair, and they are a 25 gang when they joined into the coalition its not their fault that when they get 2 gangs on them that they ask from back up from other people.

If

What i can't understand is you doing a 2 vs 1 and when every gang has had enough of ballas and triads being together against everyone and 2 vs 1 almost every gang and those gangs all unite against 1 common enemy because it makes sense they get complained at.

Anyway's i don't think people should be calling out on specific things but considering you had to mention it it's only fair it gets answered.

If you want to have triads and ballas allied might aswell prepare to have every single gang against you to see if you enjoy the same that other gangs have been dealing with.

Lmao first of all im talking about way more back in the day before the coalition. When Azballas was there or all the other alliances there was no complaining. 

Also very great response m8:
"If you want to have triads and ballas allied might aswell prepare to have every single gang against you to see if you enjoy the same that other gangs have been dealing with."

In RP we didn't know what the coalition is/was as far as WE know they were still aztecas and apostels still 2 gangs 2 safehouses 2 f6's 2 times the storage. 
 

Don't be hypocritical is all im saying.

Also sorry that the ballas and triads are active int the server and we have the numbers! must be our fault. 
 

 

[Liam]

Ballas and Triads do not 2v1 other gangs, we have always fought our induvidual fights (for example, Triads vs Hustlers and Ballas vs Grove) as far as I know, the Coalition still have their seperate gang rosters, safehoues & safe's they can all still access. 

(Not a staff opinion, just wanted to point that out that's all )

The Coalition are made up of Aztecas and Apostles, both of them together are 25 max. They will be one gang as soon as Developers approve it and Aztecas/Apostles will be no more AFAIK. Ballas and Triads are 50 max.

 

[Bmav]

Ballas and Triads do not 2v1 other gangs, we have always fought our induvidual fights (for example, Triads vs Hustlers and Ballas vs Grove) as far as I know, the Coalition still have their seperate gang rosters, safehoues & safe's they can all still access. 

(Not a staff opinion, just wanted to point that out that's all )

Very interesting you say that, thats why when you go threaten other gangs you go with both ballas and triads right ?

 

[Archie]

I am going to reply with what I had said in the gang lead chat regards to this.

This would not be a hardship if people could understand that wars should  have a build up and story before gunning and calling all out war for each other when someone says x and ego's are hurt over one situation. I personally feel alliances are important and staple pieces to gangs lore and to the server however at this current state of gangs most are not trusted to clean there own backsides so defiantly can not trust people to make alliances. My two centz

The issue is with alliances as of recent is that it leads to wars with 125 people, what would be a very good reason for all out war of 125ish people? Most of these wars have been started because small little beef's and people upset which becomes full out war which is just stupid. Like I said at the last meeting it should be a thing of weeks built up of story and meaning for why you are doing x as you are risking everything to go to war. You go to war and police have everything as you become stupid, ie pushing turfs and being watched and no care in the world. Surrounding hospitals with open carrying firearms? Your actions have consequences so It will lead to raids to everything you own, gang safes, house safes, storage containers and vehicle trunks. It seems to be a lack of understanding that war is a big thing and you guys play the war game like its Despacito in 2017. If you guys were treated the way you should be treated for your actions I can almost guarantee, I and others would receive messages about how unfair it is. Actions have consequences and hopefully people learn quickly. (Remember this is my insight, so don't think I am saying devs hate you) 
 

 

[PinkSprinkles]

Seems your post Liam is more about removing the ballas/triad alliance- not all alliances. 

In the pushes that have happened we have never been truly over the cap of 25 in total and if it was for that one fight it will likely have only been a couple people so bringing in the cap doesn't make much sense. 

Ballas/triads are the most active gangs id say in terms of decent numbers so when we are all together it does look like a lot of people and ANY other alliances could look like that too had they have the same numbers and active members. 

 

[KennethZoid]

Ballas and Triads do not 2v1 other gangs, we have always fought our induvidual fights (for example, Triads vs Hustlers and Ballas vs Grove) as far as I know, the Coalition still have their seperate gang rosters, safehoues & safe's they can all still access. 

Anytime during our Alliance if one of us was at war, we always communicated with each other that we want the 1v1 but if the enemy decides to get a third party involved, so will we.

(Not a staff opinion, just wanted to point that out that's all )

Sorry but personally think to say that in game when we announced we are becoming one is power gaming no? Since in the real world a turf or an f6 isnt a real thing? Seems weird that it keeps being brung up tbh.

 

[Logan]

+1 From a police and civ POV it’s never been a fun situation when witnessing a ridiculous amount of gang numbers growing even larger when allying with other gangs in the server just to overthrow police and bully smaller gangs.

In my opinion, the 25 Cap is there for a reason, and people are just pushing there luck.

 

[Liam]

-1, its seems again that because people have formed one gang they want every other gang to end their alliance but when they had their alliance wasn't an issue it just seems that once people realise how powerful people can be they seem to cry, moving to police it just seems that they don't want gangs at all again because when they lose a situation it damages their ego but its different when police that don't lose anything when losing a gun, but when police constantly hit gangs for example they raided triads like 3 times in 2 months, you should be able to ask allies for help and stand up for each other, for me removing alliances would just finish off gangs completely and kill most experiences for gang members. 

It's me who wants gang alliances to end, I am not a Coalition Gang member, I am not an Azteca, I am not an Apostle. I never once said that I don't want gangs at all, without gangs there isn't much for we as Police to do on the server. Triads were raided 3 times in the past 2 months for the constant robbing and killing of cops and not to mention the push on the police station.

 

[Ponty]

From the point of view I have of this matter, gangs having intermittent "allegiances" to work toward a common goal is not the main issue. The issue present is that in how overtly it is done.

Let's address the elephant in the room shall we?
The alliance between the Triads and the Ballas.

This alliance between the two in and of itself is not a major issue, but when it is done so in such a manner that the gang essentially doubles in size, firepower, assets and funds.
It becomes not only unfair to other gangs who have to contend with said "super-gang" but also the factions and civvies that get caught up in the crossfire or in some cases, are targeted directly.
The RP basis to this alliance is not something I am fully aware of, so I won't speculate too much, but the only justification I can see for the alliance is that there was a wedding that occurred between the two groups.

This post will inevitably be hijacked and people who comment are driven by agenda, which is perfectly fine.
The best process here is that staff and devs review the feedback and comments made and come to a decision.
If commenters make their feedback and leave it at that, it will yield the best possible results.
 

 

[Tom]

-1, this seems to be aimed at triads x ballas, just because 2 gangs which are ACTIVE and have a good alliance doesn't mean other gangs could do the same.  

 

[Edwago - R Henderson]

This was ridiculous, gangs forcing themselves into a situation to rob and kill us for Police Issued weapons when the Lost MC Person was merely handing in a musket and a knife to the police, completely steam rolled all RP that we would've had from that guy to then be shot and robbed of everything 50 man deep in front of the entire police service in broad daylight.

From my perspective I some what agree with what you have said Liam and some from Connor, disagree with some also.. reference the above, granted we shouldnt have ever got to this point in my opinion ( everyone rolling around together ) but we are at that point or were, so to expect a diferent reaction to what happened when this lost member was "handing in a weapon" right infront of everyone in a very tense situation was asking for trouble. If i was the police officer in that situation I would have asked the lost member in question to come to the station or very least move out of the high tense situtional area.

Onto the "No alliances thing" again this is my opinion only. The Coalation, even the word itself means 2 groups, and at this time they still are 2 groups with a lot of people, 2 turfs. So Ballas were fine to bring along triads, then if obviously escalated to more groups getting involved - Mara / 229 / Padrinos all against Ballas and Triads and got out of hand for a day, but was resolved, warnings from admins were heard and leaders worked to resolve the situation.

Alliances are fine, its realistic and viable in RP,  when it comes to wars they should be gang v gang, alliances can help getting people to hospital / supply of items and such. I think this situation was just bad timing / poor information in relation to official gang merges etc, I dont forsee this happening again if Coalation "gang" gets sorted officially to avoid any confusion. Maybe all wars should be vetted by staff for reasoning and RP and set rules before anyone goes trigger happy.

 

[Liam]

Seems your post Liam is more about removing the ballas/triad alliance- not all alliances. 

In the pushes that have happened we have never been truly over the cap of 25 in total and if it was for that one fight it will likely have only been a couple people so bringing in the cap doesn't make much sense. 

Ballas/triads are the most active gangs id say in terms of decent numbers so when we are all together it does look like a lot of people and ANY other alliances could look like that too had they have the same numbers and active members. 

My post is regarding gang alliances of all gangs and this post has only came about because, yes the Ballas and Triad Alliance that completely overpowers all groups on the server, this post was made to better the server not to ruin your experience.