Taking control of the unmc checkpoint

[blaze1981]

This action is becoming a real problem for us lately and i would love a discussion in how we could make this better. My problem with this happening is that it only happens on two certain occasions,

number 1 certain rebel gangs have houses closer to the checkpoint than our base meaning as soon as the server restarts they run in to the checkpoint whilst its empty resulting in hours of gunfights whilst we try and take it back resulting in normal civs being unable to use our lands and more often than not getting killed in the crossfire, this also takes away hours of potential roleplay.

number 2 gangs will wait until our checkpoint is severly under maned then will role in and either kill or take the one or two guys who are in there hostage resulting in the same senario as point number one

as long as we have a decent number of men on duty at the checkpoint these situations never arise and we have some amazing role play situations with people who actualy want to use our lands without causing chaos.

so i would like people from all sides to try and come up with ways we can combat these situations as i dont mind the occasional take over of our checkpoint but every restart is becoming a pain in the ass.

the solutions i have come up with are maybe make it so gangs cannot take over our checkpoint within 15 minutes of a restart enabling us time to get the checkpoint team on duty inside before it can be taken. Alternitavly we could maybe get a spawn point inside the checkpoint meaning we can get in there before anyone else.

It would be nice if we can get a decent discussion going as these constant 4 hour firefights are starting to really spoil the enjoyment for my guys as our roleplay oppertunities are becoming limited as were constantly fighting battles

 

[Olle-Theodor]

I like this idea! I remember  when I would go to the black market, I did not even come up to the barrier before I got shot...
 
1+

 

[unconnected]

As someone from TI, I'm keenly aware of the issues that come with taking over this checkpoint. I suggest the following:

• Require a certain number of UNMC online before the checkpoint can be overtaken (similar to the bank job)
• Give the UNMC some sort of exemption to RDM in and around the checkpoint (when it has been taken over), so they can use whatever force they need to get it back
• After a certain time limit (say an hour of statemate) allow the use of the armed hellcat on ground targets
• After 2 or more hours of stalemate (and use of the armed hellcat was insufficient) AND an admin is present, allow them the use of a APC with 40mm cannon.

 

[Fruityrudy]

Yes im really fed up with this aswell Blaze 

I joined the UNMC cause it is a white listed organisation who primary target is to RP .....

Lately we have bin forced to 0/10 RP most of the times cause multiple gangs who seem to have problems with us attack or take over the checkpoint every day ... they even do team up for this "fun""

As i said my primary target when i play on this amazing server is RP and have a great time and interact with all the other fine people who join us every day 

I hope we can have a fine discussion about this soon and improve all this for us but also for all the others on the server

 

[Garlic91]

As someone from TI, I'm keenly aware of the issues that come with taking over this checkpoint. I suggest the following:

• Require a certain number of UNMC online before the checkpoint can be overtaken (similar to the bank job)
  
• Give the UNMC some sort of exception to RDM in and around the checkpoint (when it has been taken over), so they can use whatever force they need to get it back
• After a certain time limit (say an hour of statemate) allow the use of the armed hellcat on ground targets
• After 2 or more hours of stalemate (and use of the armed hellcat was insufficient) AND an admin is present, allow them the use of a APC with 40mm cannon.

 
I'm sure this would alleviate the problem straight away but would that not then require the UNMC to be part of a separate "player group", for example cops and NHS are separate to civs or could this be done on UID? I think the 15 minutes idea is good also because as the OP states, certain gangs have houses closer than the UNMC to their own checkpoint, surely that can't be right. 

 

[Fruityrudy]

imo there should be server rules regarding to the checkpoint , we are white listed organisation like police and NHS and they have rules aswell so i hope those will be made very soon 

 

[unconnected]

Give the checkpoint a purple zone colour on the map (like the green and blue ones) and say in the legend (and rules) that there needs to be X number of UNMC on before it can be taken (I think 5 is a good start).

I personally think there should be a 'nuclear' deterrent to shit going down in UNMC, a 40mm armed APC is precisely this. If an admin can spectate the use of it (and it needs to be limited to very high ranking UNMC players) and it's put away straight after the shit has been sorted, then it fits the bill. The UNMC is a military group, having ONE APC is not unrealistic and the 40mm rounds have more than enough power to penetrate any structure in the checkpoint area with ease. Just make sure it's a bannable offense for it to be stolen (this can be covered in RP that civs dont have the training etc).

Plus it's the ultimate recruitment tool (not that they need it according to Sovereign's post!).

 

[fuckThisImOut]

40mm apc? That would remove any possibility of any take over.It would also not kill anyone considering the anti vdm script. Also your more likely to demolish buildings rather than kill anyone inside.

I also think if unmc have no one on then sometimes we man ot and charge like the unmc, get some nice rp too. So have a limit of unmc members imo isnt a solution.

Just give them a spawn at unmc its not hard, its already coded tbh "donator". Just copy n paste lol.

Maybe a time limit at server start also.

If unmc cant handle the checkpoint with snipers and striders then tbh that is their fail. They have more than enough members.

Give em a spawn point thats what I think.

 

[unconnected]

Frankly, there shouldn't be much chance of a full 4hr take over of the checkpoint, it's owned by a MILITARY faction, not just some rag tag gang.

The 40mm is a vehicle weapon, therefore it will still kill (otherwise the armed offroad wouldn't kill and I can assure you it does).

As I said, it would be used as a weapon of last resort and one monitored by an admin at that. If the UNMC can't take their checkpoint back after several hours then it starts getting in the way of other peoples activities and to reiterate, they're not supposed to be just another gang, they're meant to be a military force, which means when the shit hits the fan they should have the hardware to deal with it.

A 40mm cannon is just enough to make short work of anyone loitering around the checkpoint and it takes quite a few (many in fact) 40mm rounds to bring down a tower, go try it in the editor.

 

[Kris!]

The only reason Pro La Fam got involved in any checkpoints raids were in retaliation for either;

A: Attitude of UNMC members being rude and arrogant or trolling.

B: In retaliation for a UNMC attack on our base.

Given this doesn't happen in the future, the family will not attack on the UNMC zone, so you've got no concerns on that.

As for other gangs, I'd suggest ironing out the issues with them.

 

[Ali E]

Well first off all giving a 40 mm cannon thingy to them would be so unfair and will cause troubles that is not an logical idea. And the thing is we want a good fight with you guys but all we get is getting sniped from your base which we must get approve from an adn in order to get in there and kill the sniper thats unfair and please dont tell me that we can kill the sniper with what we have because we cant mk 18 has 1 km range and the precise range from the check point to base is 1.3 and second your armed chopper is always hunting us always. We were in the UNMC territory and suddenly while were fighting an armed hellcat comes in sprays us all in the hellcat twice i think this hellcat should be taken out for ultimate attacks not when me and 4 of my friends came to territory.

 

[unconnected]

Why is it unfair though? I'm playing devils advocate here as I'm not part of UNMC, but people complaining it's unfair need to understand that even a paramilitary gang shouldn't stand a chance against a full on military force.

And remember this is an RP server, it shouldn't be shooty shooty all the time. An APC will remove any people sticking around for too long and it'll all be back to normal so everyone can RP as before.

 

[Ali E]

Well if we dont stand a chance against a faction wheres the fun of fighting? You guys were askimg ah-9 pawnee's because you thought it was unfair to fight with UNMC with their big toys now because of your war is over are you suggesting them to get a nuke?

 

[unconnected]

I didn't suggest it and frankly the idea of a civ with a pawnee is absurd. Also, our "fight" with the UNMC was a giant cluster fuck and I honestly wish it never happened, when @Vladic Ka keeps popping into your TS channel dealing with bans and reports you'll agree too (plus it's not fair on poor old Vladic).

Besides I'm not saying you shouldn't be able to take over the checkpoint, if there is a legitimate fight for it (i.e. more than a few UNMC on) then you should be able to take it over and tax people or whatever. But at some point and with a ramp up over time, that checkpoint should be harder and harder to hold and if you've got it after 2hrs or more then it needs to come to an end as you're fighting a military force. So the APC is an ideal end game. It still has tyres, so you can immobilize it if you're cunning and it has the firepower and armor to give a real advantage to the UNMC.

And just remember, a lot of the UNMC don't want to fight constantly - that's not what they're for, they're also here to RP and if that means they get a bigger gun than us to bring back the RP, then I'm all for it.

 

[blaze1981]

keep the discussion civil guys as this was a post for everyone to have there say so theres no right or wrong answers as everyones opinion is valid, as for a cannon no way that type of armoury should never be allowed on the island as the temptation to abuse it might be to much for some people,

as for whats fair or unfair you have to remember we are the armed forces not a rebel group so our weaponry is always going to be stronger and more efficient its like saying there should be no war in afghanistan as the taliban dont have the sophistacated weaponry the allied forces have so it isnt fair.

 

[Sovereign]

I must say that a 40mm cannon on a mobile armored platform is overkill,even if it's goal is an end game to hours of fighting which it can do well. The police had a Marshal IFV with a 30mm cannon in the beginning of the server and everyone flipped their shit. 

Suicide vests and/or mortars would clear it out though and both are shootable. Seriously though I don't want to see any heavy armament added without a full boardroom meeting. Only then even if no other alternative comes forward. As 4 hours of fighting is from restart to restart with no RP.

 

[Khandamir]

Suggestions to the UNMC Armoury:

As sovereign said,

- Mortars

- Suicide vests

My suggestions:

- Armed drones

- Armed jets

- Suitcase nukes

- White phosphorous (thanks to Lt. White)

- Handgrenades

- Molotov cocktails

- Rocketlaunchers

- Laser satelites

- Deathstar

No.. seriously. Just roleplay with us, have the occasional shootout, try if you're badass enough to rob at our drugdealer But don't do it all the time

 

[Ali E]

I agree that UNMC can get bigger toys cause theyre the army however giving them a weapon which we cant disable or destroy is so absurd it would be a fight which rebels cant win and its not really realistic and will even ruin the gun fights and your thoughts about the civilians can use your lands when someone holds the checkpoint is wrong when we man the checkpoint we let every civil and rebel to pass free

 

[Sovereign]

I agree that UNMC can get bigger toys cause theyre the army however giving them a weapon which we cant disable or destroy is so absurd it would be a fight which rebels cant win and its not really realistic and will even ruin the gun fights and your thoughts about the civilians can use your lands when someone holds the checkpoint is wrong when we man the checkpoint we let every civil and rebel to pass free

That is why I disagree with the Gorgon that was suggested(The description of 40mm cannon and tires copies it.) as it cannot be destroyed and therefore I suggested infantry based assets if absolutely necessary.(I still don't want them unless there is no better alternative.) 

Not entirely sure what your saying clearly in the second part of your paragraph. UNMC charge less than 10% the normal drug run with the occasional discount when salt comes through. Rebels that take it over frequently are not interested in taxing when they take it over,they want a fight,I know,because I spoke with some of them. The methods,frequency, and length of time it takes is the problem we have with it. Usually we've seen people rob or kill when trying to pass through on server 2 when we're not around so that is likely what would happen as we've seen it before.