Report a Player - Pee Money - RDM (Action Taken - Warning)

[NF DMT]

Your In-game name

[NF] DMT

Name of the player(s) you are reporting

Pee Money

Date of the incident

29/11/17

Time of the incident (GMT)

20

What best describes this incident ?

RDM

Which server did the incident take place on

Server 1
Teamspeak

Please (in detail) describe the incident

We just try to rob that two trucks and we told them to stop or tires will be shot. And they just start moving away and Pee Money just sniped us from the mountain. But these guys didnt say anything or they have friends around. And later the run away from them, we didnt fight with them and they just rdm us.
Sorry for black screen some times its maximum 5seconds.

Link to any evidence (Youtube/Screenshot)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g68YIIjr_HA&feature=youtu.be
This report is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth!

Yes

You tried to resolve the situation with the player(s) before reporting

Yes

This is not a revenge report (Abuse will lead to forum/community bans)

Yes

 

[TCK Pee Money]

So we’ve had a few disagreements with you guys and it’s getting petty and silly. I feel yourself and your gang are looking to find any reason to get us banned.
[NF] Gora
tck u searching for another report ?
The above quote really highlights that.

On to the video, this video has clearly been edited multiple times and I think all evidence within it should be carefully considered for its legitimacy.
So the first portion that you appear to have an issue with, we’re leaving the drug dealer and you decide to give a pretty terrible barely audible sentence about shooting the tyres to one of the trucks. You provide low quality roleplay and start shooting.
(2.2) Random Deathmatch (also known as RDM) - Shooting at someone without engaging in any form of quality role play (eg. Giving enough time for them to comply with your order. Count downs are not considered quality roleplay, please at least attempt to create an interesting roleplay story before considering shooting.) is considered RDM. (Punishment is a ban).
You’ve already broken this rule in that case, you shot at us without engaging in any form of quality roleplay. 
So you shoot at all the trucks after providing poor roleplay to just one of them, you don’t know we’re together and don’t know if we’re affiliated or not and yet shoot every truck in sight.
So the problem you have is that I return fire and kill you, you can hear the glass smash on one of the truck windows at 0:56 in your video, you actually hit and injure Mattay at this point and nearly kill him. At this point we’re in a fully-fledged gunfight, roleplay is no longer possible and you’ve shot one of my gang mates, how on earth and I meant to somehow inform you that I have friends, I’m not alone etc etc etc. It’s physically not possible because you’re shooting at us. I fire back to save the lives of my gangmates. 
I’m in no doubt I was well within my rights to fire back when you’re spraying hundreds of rounds at my gangmates.

I dunno why your video is so long maybe you thought i had RDM'd you as well at the end of the video. You already started the gunfight at the drug dealer you were followed the whole time by either myself or another gang member in a heli. I was within my rights again to shoot you as there is no set time frame on how long a gunfight can last as long as you have had eyes on them the whole time.

Pee 

 

[Gora]

I said i was sorry for the quote, literally had everything handled, i don't know why are u bringing this up.

 

[TCK Pee Money]

I said i was sorry for the quote, literally had everything handled, i don't know why are u bringing this up.

I'm bringing this up as this is 1 of a few silly things you lot put in OOC. Here is something else you lot put quite often after we kill one of you " When is comp "

I'm one of the worst ones for putting stupid shit in side chat i'll admit that, but that's just me having banter with other players. You actually mean this.

Pee

 

[LONG BEARD]

Just to clarify something here. 

If a gang member is shot at, and you're far away from him, you're 'not' involved. The only people involved are the shooters, and the people in the vehicles they're shooting at. To become involved, your 'involved' gang members need to declare your involvement i.e. 'friends in the area'. If they're not able to do that for whatever reason, you need to initiate separately. 

 

[TCK Pee Money]

Just to clarify something here. 

If a gang member is shot at, and you're far away from him, you're 'not' involved. The only people involved are the shooters, and the people in the vehicles they're shooting at. To become involved, your 'involved' gang members need to declare your involvement i.e. 'friends in the area'. If they're not able to do that for whatever reason, you need to initiate separately. 

This kind of behaviour happens on the servers daily and nothing is ever said about it.

If this was a rule we are all aware about then cops would be reporting rebels everyday the amount of times i have seen cops shoot at tyres and the rebel either decamp and shoot back or have their friends shoot the cops. Now if this is a new rule then we all need to be made aware of this rule in someway , maybe a server message to say that rules have changed and then it directs us to a thread on the forum or whatever.

The amount of times the cops have responded to a call were their friends have already been dead several mins, they are not even aware of whats going on they just set up and start to shoot. Now if this rule applies to rebels then surely it applies to the cops as well as it's the same thing, they should be made to initiate separately.

 

[LONG BEARD]

Whether you've seen it done, doesn't mean it's right. There's too many possible scenarios to cover, but in the situation shown here, if cops had been the ones to shoot tires, and someone from a hill took them out it's still considered RDM. 

the amount of times i have seen cops shoot at tyres and the rebel either decamp and shoot back or have their friends shoot the cops

Unless the cops have been informed that there are friends in the area prepared to engage, it would be RDM if they're sniped by gang mates. 

The amount of times the cops have responded to a call were their friends have already been dead several mins, they are not even aware of whats going on they just set up and start to shoot. Now if this rule applies to rebels then surely it applies to the cops as well as it's the same thing, they should be made to initiate separately.

In the scenario you describe, it's already classified as an active gunfight with confirmed officers down, or shots fired at police. In this case, it's only people with fire arms that are engaged as they're deemed involved.  If you're not involved, you leave the area.  Someone running around without a gun will usually be asked to leave the area. 

Uniformed cops / UNMC don't need to initiate separately because they're deemed involved due to the fact they're in uniform (and drive marked high viz vehicles). Undercover cops, or plain clothed UNCM on the other hand DO need to initiate separately for the same reasons gangs do. 

So lets flip this scenario around, If uniformed cops came under fire, and an undercover cop is on the hill at the location you where, even though he's in the same 'gang' and just seen his colleagues get shot at, he's unable to shoot until he initiates separately or his colleagues inform the other side he's in the area to assist. Why? because the other side have no way to know he's involved.

This aint a new rule btw. The 'friends in the area' thing has been around a long time.
 

 

[TCK Pee Money]

Well I’d like to know where in the rules it mentions this whole “friends in the area” thing. I follow the rules as they are written to the best of my ability and stay within those but it’s near enough impossible to know all of these unwritten rules and stick to them, especially when the staff interpretation of said unwritten rules changes depending on whom you ask. In this case I guess I may have fallen foul of this unwritten rule, all I know is Matty informed me he had been shot at and injured by the gunfire of these guys so I’ve returned fire, the opportunity for roleplay had passed and I fired back. Although I wasn’t in a truck and I guess you could say because of this I wasn’t ‘qualified’ to get involved I was of the impression I was entitled to shoot back due to the fact they were in the process of attempting to kill my gang members (and nearly did so).
I feel I’ve stuck to the server rules and will admit I have fallen foul of this unwritten rule and will put my hands up and admit that but I don’t feel I should be punished for breaking a rule that technically doesn’t even exist.
I would hope you would take this into consideration when deciding my fate. I play to have fun but I play within the rules as they are written upon the rules page.

Pee

So lets flip this scenario around, If uniformed cops came under fire, and an undercover cop is on the hill at the location you where, even though he's in the same 'gang' and just seen his colleagues get shot at, he's unable to shoot until he initiates separately or his colleagues inform the other side he's in the area to assist. Why? because the other side have no way to know he's involved.

Cops need to be made aware of this then as this does not happen, just yesterday undercover cops were running around with AR shooting people and no separate initiation was made.

 

[TCK Pee Money]

So lets flip this scenario around, If uniformed cops came under fire, and an undercover cop is on the hill at the location you where, even though he's in the same 'gang' and just seen his colleagues get shot at, he's unable to shoot until he initiates separately or his colleagues inform the other side he's in the area to assist. Why? because the other side have no way to know he's involved.

Cops do not initiate separately this was a gunfight with the cops that lasted over 30 mins halfway through undercover cops decide to land and shoot without a word said along with another 2 that decamped the same heli 500m on a hill.

This video is not to get anyone in trouble i don't want that i'm posting it as an example.

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[LONG BEARD]

@Pee Money

The video you've provided doesn't show whether your gang was informed at some point prior to the shooting that undercover units where in the area to assist. If they were, then the actions by the undercover officers involved was fine. If on the other hand no notification was given, then it's not fine. To clarify, undercover officers can only engage if A) it's been announced by other officers that undercover officers are in the area to assist, or B) they identify themselves independently as undercover officers before they engage.  if this happens in the future, you're within your rights to report these players. If someone in your gang is informed verbally that there's undercover officers involved, then it's their responsibility to feed that information back to the rest of the gang because undercover cops will assume this has been done. Once this has been done, during an active gunfight, you'd be well within your rights to drop any non gang members with a visible weapon. 

Now on to the main issue detailed in this report. I'll repeat for the sake of clarity. If a gang member is shot at and you're not in psychical close proximity at the time, you are not involved and 'must' initiate separately before you're able to engage, OR, your gang members must verbally inform the opposing side that they have friends in the area who are willing to engage.

Since you've stated you had mixed interpretations depending on which staff members you asked, I'll divulge in the interests of transparity, I sought opinions from other staff members including staff leads who concurred with my take on this.

With that said, going by your initial reply to the report, I can see that you had genuine confusion over this rule and that your actions were not malicious, nor did you willingly intend to break a server rule.

For this reason, I'm satisfied that a warning is sufficient to ensure this doesn't happen again. 

Action Taken

Warning Point Added : Pee Money