Report a Player - Papi Chulo, Zephy - RDM<br>Poor/Low Quality RP<br>Other (Action Taken)

[RendoirS]

Your In-game name

[RWC] MAJ. Cheslav

Name of the player(s) you are reporting

Papi Chulo, Zephy

Date of the incident

02/21/2017

Time of the incident (GMT)

330

What best describes this incident ?

RDM
Poor/Low Quality RP
Other

Which server did the incident take place on

Server 1

Please (in detail) describe the incident

I initiate on a guy on the weed processor. Told him to put his hands up and threat his life, he start trying to wallbang me, and after that i start shotting at him aswell. He just didn't speak about his friends when get initiated. After kill him, he was on the ground for something around 4:30 min. Suddenly he says "i have friends on the area and we start getting shotted".
After that just a gun fight went off.


He tried to solve this, unfortunelly nothing this get solved

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HprSamDWeec&amp;feature=youtu.be

Link to any evidence (Youtube/Screenshot)

http://plays.tv/video/58abbeb8bd156fce1c
This report is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth!

Yes

You tried to resolve the situation with the player(s) before reporting

Yes

This is not a revenge report (Abuse will lead to forum/community bans)

Yes

EDIT: Forgot to told. My issues are:

1- They didn't warned us about their friends on the area before getting downed.

2- He was talking with his friends (by ts3) while downed (you can see it that his mic is only getting muted at 5:36).

( Rule 5.4 ) - While you are downed you may not divulge tactical information to anyone. The exception to this is information spoken in direct chat in game. Please be mindful that you are heavily injured and should act accordingly.

3- Only told about their friends when he was downed, at 5:45 and didn't threat us. At 6:11 you can clearly hear shots).

( Rule 5.4 ) - You may not actively enter or continue any combat situation for the next 15 minutes.

4- I dont really believe that you are able to initiate after being downed.

( Rule 5.4 ) - You may not actively enter or continue any combat situation for the next 15 minutes.

5- Considering that was no initiation, we got RDM'd by Zephy.

( Rule 2.2 ) - Random Deathmatch (also known as RDM) - Shooting at someone without engaging in any form of quality role play (eg. Giving enough time for them to comply with your order. Count downs are not considered quality roleplay, please at least attempt to create an interesting roleplay story before considering shooting.) is considered RDM. (Punishment is a ban).

Btw, those timers are from the playstv clip.

 

[PabIo]

Just for the admin that has to deal with this. We have tried resolving this issue for two days to no avail. Even when at their request to get a staff member in the staff member agreed that no rule breaks had occurred on our part and the only thing that stands is there fail RP initiation. The helper warned them that if they put a report up that they'd maybe get done for fail RP. 

This post just seems to not help the situation at all as it shows there out for banning other members of the community. In the situation both sides lost an equal amount of money. Despite the many attempts to resolve the situations it seems that it will continue more for a prolonged amount of time on the forums.

@Auxen was the staff members that dealt with it.

Also i was there at the situation and have spoke in all of the issues that needed " Resolving " 

 

[ZephyOG]

Just letting you know that it is required to have 3-5mins before the accused RDM takes place as shown here : https://www.roleplay.co.uk/topic/66650-roleplaycouk-report-a-player-rules/

RDM/VDM Reports
"We request your video evidence show at least 3-5 minutes leading up to the situation".

 

[Chewbastian]

My point of view

 

[RendoirS]

Just for the admin that has to deal with this. We have tried resolving this issue for two days to no avail. Even when at their request to get a staff member in the staff member agreed that no rule breaks had occurred on our part and the only thing that stands is there fail RP initiation. The helper warned them that if they put a report up that they'd maybe get done for fail RP. 

This post just seems to not help the situation at all as it shows there out for banning other members of the community. In the situation both sides lost an equal amount of money. Despite the many attempts to resolve the situations it seems that it will continue more for a prolonged amount of time on the forums.

@Auxen was the staff members that dealt with it.

Also i was there at the situation and have spoke in all of the issues that needed " Resolving " 

We tried to solve this yesterday after the gun fight (something around 03:30, 21/02/2017) and we agreed that we couldn't resolve that by ourselves, so we wait untill today to call a staff member. We did, and unfortunately we didn't solve it anyway, so i put the report on the forum.

Just letting you know that it is required to have 3-5mins before the accused RDM takes place as shown here : https://www.roleplay.co.uk/topic/66650-roleplaycouk-report-a-player-rules/

RDM/VDM Reports
"We request your video evidence show at least 3-5 minutes leading up to the situation".

Both of the clips are longer than 5 mins. But thanks for the advise anyway

 

[ZephyOG]

We tried to solve this yesterday after the gun fight (something around 03:30, 21/02/2017) and we agreed that we couldn't resolve that by ourselves, so we wait untill today to call a staff member. We did, and unfortunately we didn't solve it anyway, so i put the report on the forum.

Both of the clips are longer than 5 mins. But thanks for the advise anyway

It says clearly in the rules 5 minutes before leading up to the situation.

 

[PabIo]

 We did, and unfortunately we didn't solve it anyway, so i put the report on the forum.

Well that's straight up a lie. Just because you didn't get the answer you wanted doesn't mean that no answer. The helper said that the situation was so messy that there isnt a resolve. He agreed that our party broke no rules and the only thing standing was the terrible initiation that you guys had given. Yet you guys still persist and chasing everything to get a result your not gonna get. Ive spent hours trying to resolve this and nothing seems to satisfy your needs, its ridiculous. 

 

[RendoirS]

It says clearly in the rules 5 minutes before leading up to the situation.

Ohh, you mean even before we initiate on the guy ? Dont really think that is needed on this specific case, but if the staff member needs it, just tell me, i can upload that.

Well that's straight up a lie. Just because you didn't get the answer you wanted doesn't mean that no answer. The helper said that the situation was so messy that there isnt a resolve. He agreed that our party broke no rules and the only thing standing was the terrible initiation that you guys had given. Yet you guys still persist and chasing everything to get a result your not gonna get. Ive spent hours trying to resolve this and nothing seems to satisfy your needs, its ridiculous. 

I tried to stay on the channel, i was talking and you guys just left the channel and moved each others to another room.

 

[PabIo]

Ohh, you mean even before we initiate on the guy ? Dont really think that is needed on this specific case, but if the staff member needs it, just tell me, i can upload that.

I tried to stay on the channel, i was talking and you guys just left the channel and moved each others to another room.

No. After around 20 mins at least with @Auxen we come to the conclusion that nothing was gonna happen. Both parties lost cash and the situation was such a clusterfuck that there was no result ion apart from dropping the situation. We all agreed that this would carry on for a endless amount of time and nothing would be resolved hence why the helper left the lobby and everyone followed suit. Its so ridiculous this situation that its carried on for the time it has. We have lives around this server and IRL stuff takes over. Half of us had to go due to getting food/ work and other things. We didn't leave because we chose to forget and drop the situation. We left also because the only authority to make a decision the helper had left. We'd be wasting our breath otherwise.

 

[RendoirS]

No. After around 20 mins at least with @Auxen we come to the conclusion that nothing was gonna happen. Both parties lost cash and the situation was such a clusterfuck that there was no result ion apart from dropping the situation. We all agreed that this would carry on for a endless amount of time and nothing would be resolved hence why the helper left the lobby and everyone followed suit. Its so ridiculous this situation that its carried on for the time it has. We have lives around this server and IRL stuff takes over. Half of us had to go due to getting food/ work and other things. We didn't leave because we chose to forget and drop the situation. We left also because the only authority to make a decision the helper had left. We'd be wasting our breath otherwise.

That was your conclusion about that situation, not mine ...

I asked you for a comp, you just refused. If you dont feel like you should pay for it, its alright. On the other hand, i dont feel the same, so I think that i have my right to post the report since we didn't solve anything after get a huge conversation. 

You are free to defende yourself, and its completly understandable

I will just not answer anymore untill a staff members ask for it cause I already expose all of my problems with this situation.

 

[Chewbastian]

My point of view​

I'll go through the video step by step and I'll talk about what was discussed on teamspeak about each section of the video.​

TIMELINE:​

@ 0:00 Cheslav initiates. @ 1:19 Papi chulo was downed. @5:25 Papi chulo tells us he has friends in the area. @5:34 the first shots after papi was downed were shot.  @6:02 I executed papi. @6:07 I was shot.​

The initiation by Cheslav:​

In teamspeak Auxen said that the initiation was bad. And apparently because of it Cobra thinks that we're somehow at fault here. I'm not quite sure what did Cheslav do wrong. He just told what Papi should do and then papi started shooting. Cheslav didnt fire the first shots.

[SIZE=medium](2.2) Random Deathmatch (also known as RDM) - Shooting at someone without engaging in any form of quality role play (eg. Giving enough time for them to comply with your order. Count downs are not considered quality roleplay, please at least attempt to create an interesting roleplay story before considering shooting.) is considered RDM. (Punishment is a ban).[/SIZE]

[SIZE=medium](7.1.3) Killing someone must be carried out with high roleplay, “put your hands up or I will shoot” etc is considered low RP and may lead to a ban for RDM/Fail RP. [/SIZE]

Neither of these rules were broken during the initiation.

They didnt kill him because they said “put your hands up or I will shoot”. They killed papi because he started shooting.

So basically @Auxen and @Cobra saying that cheslav somehow fail rp'd would mean that you're supposed to have a conversation with the people you're about to rob before you tell them to put their hands up or it would be concidered fail rp. I've literally never heard this point of view before and it is against 90% of robberies I've seen on this server. Getting a clarification to these statements would be great.

Papi Chulo being downed:​

Papi chulo got downed. After being downed for 4 minutes and 6 seconds he informed us that he has friends in the area.

[SIZE=medium](5.4) When you are revived/downed:[/SIZE]

While you are downed you may not divulge tactical information to anyone. The exception to this is information spoken in direct chat in

The fact that he witheld the information about having friends in the area points to the fact that he must've given his gang information about the situation at the weed processor and his gang telling him when they are in position in teamspeak. How else could he know the exact time to tell us he has friends in the area so his friends could start shooting. The first shots were fired before I had my gun out. The timing of the shots was organized. These claims were denied by everyone in the Ascension gang. They do not have / wont provide us with a recording from their point of view.

First shots after papi getting downed:​

The first shots after Papi getting downed were shot by Papi's gang after 4 minutes and 15 seconds. Just 9 seconds after he told us he has friends in the area. None of us had fired shots after papi had gotten downed. Our first shot was fired by me 4 minutes and 43 seconds after papi was downed. I was killed after 4 minutes and 48 seconds after papi was downed.

So it all did happen in the time span of 5 minutes after papi got killed. Which means it was an active gunfight according to the rules.

What I personally have a problem with:​

I'm all about helping your friends in a gunfight and I do find it ridiculous that you have to say that you have friends in the area. It is absolutely ridiculous. But the rules are the rules. It would have been perfectly fine by me if we were shot right after the gunfight broke out, even without papi telling us he has friends nearby, but they waited for over 4 minutes to even "initate on us" via Papi Chulo. Three weeks ago I was in a situation where I shot zephy 30 seconds after he shot my friend. My friend didn't tell him he had friends in the area. Me and my friend metagamed in the situation by him telling me where zephy was after he was downed and I went there and shot zephy. The situation was resolved on teamspeak and both parties ended up giving compensation to each other(I believe it was stuart who was in ts with us). I find it ridiculous that the same people who get killed in a similiar situation whine that they were wronged. But somehow it's all ok when they do stuff like this. After the incident I've learned my lessons about the rules and I've played accordingly. Everytime my gang is in a situation I stress that they must say we're in the area or we wont be able to shoot. I've told them to mute their mics when they're downed. But I feel like some people, Zephy for example, wont ever learn. What I also have a problem with is that Papi must've talked on teamspeak after he was downed. Which led his gang to our location and to know when to open fire. Papi must've had information about his gangs location and they must've had information about ours.

I'm 100% sure if our positions were switched this report would be about us.

 

[ZephyOG]

Three weeks ago I was in a situation where I shot zephy 30 seconds after he shot my friend.​

This had nothing to do with this player report, but just to clarify I never shot your friend.....

Still waiting for the 5 minutes video before the situation.

 

[Chewbastian]

This had nothing to do with this player report, but just to clarify I never shot your friend.....

Still waiting for the 5 minutes video before the situation.

Disclaimer for any admins reading this:

I know that what I've written below isn't completely about the reported situation. But I do feel everything I've written has very strong ties to these situations and I'd like to use my opportunity to publicly share my opinions about this current situation and the problems that lead us having these issues.

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The situation we had three weeks ago was exactly the same situation with our positions switched. In the situation I'm referring to, you were armed in the area after my friend was shot and I shot you when I saw you 30 seconds after my friend was killed. In this situation that you've been reported for, I was unarmed when you started shooting at me 4 minutes and 6 seconds after your friend had been downed and I hadn't fired a single shot at your friend before you started shooting at me.

And as cheslav stated he will upload the clip if an admin finds it necessary.The video cheslav uploaded has 6 minutes of video before you started shooting and you shooting is the issue at hand. There's nothing wrong with cheslavs initiation so why would there be 5 minutes of video before it started? But as he said, if an admin finds it necessary he will upload it. Do you really think you've found some sort of a loophole that makes this report void?

Please explain to me how can't you see the contradiction in your prior actions and the actions you took in the situation concerning this report? The situation we had 3 weeks ago was exactly the same, but that time I was at fault, and I compensated you for my mistakes on our part. When I shot you 3 weeks ago your friend yelled "Come TS" and you yelled "nice initiation" in the voice chat. You knew that I had messed up. How can you say that you didn't mess up this time?

I feel like you somehow feel that these certain rules do not apply to you or the gang that you're in. You know these unwritten rules exist and you use that information for your own advantage when you get killed by a newer player. But when you do something that is against an unwritten rule you play stupid and say that it isn't a rule or that you didn't know about it. This is the most infuriating thing about these unwritten rules and I've written long posts on the forums about them. But unfortunately there hasn't been any changes to the rules and we have to play by them. You've played here for a long time. You must know these rules by now and it is proven that you do know these unwritten rules exist. Yet you've broken them in the situation you are now reported for. The way you and people like you act on this server is totally unacceptable. It really saddens me that I have to play with people like you. And by people like you I mean people who bully newer players with their superior knowledge of the server rules. This can't be the first time you've broken the rules, this could be the first time you've got caught breaking the rules. Or at least the first time you didn't pay your way out of it.

It is very childish for not owning up to your mistakes. We all make mistakes. I've made many mistakes on this server. I could've gotten banned for shooting you three weeks ago. I'm happy we got it resolved. Back then I had no idea I was supposed to initiate after my friend is being shot. I was honestly shocked when stuart said what I did was borderline RDM. After our prior situation I started playing according to the unwritten rule about these situations.

Zephy, Please man up, and tell your friends to man up aswell. We're all here to have a good time. Be more honest about your mistakes, don't try to lie your way out when you've made a mistake and please play by the rules. There's no reason to treat other people the way you do. Don't take this too personally either, I'm sure you're a great guy since you have so many likeminded friends on the server. But please consider other peoples experience aswell even though they're in a different gang. The only way we can have a pleasant community is by being a pleasant community.

 

[ZephyOG]

There's nothing wrong with cheslavs initiation so why would there be 5 minutes of video before it started? 

I am pretty sure he said something along the lines of, "put your hands up or you will be shot" 

(7.1.3) Killing someone must be carried out with high roleplay, “put your hands up or I will shoot” etc is considered low RP and may lead to a ban for RDM/Fail RP.

What he said is fail rp aka bad iniciation so there is a problem with his iniciation.

 

[Just Balls]

Hello everyone!
Before all this had happened we had robbed a truck of weed and also kidnapped a police officer. I was going to process the weed while the rest were going to handle the policeman nearby the location of the weed processing. The plan was to rob the policeman then let the officer go and join me at the processing facility.

- As i was processing I heard a heli roaming around the area and I told my friends that a heli was landing and needed help since i probably was gonna get robbed. At the time they were finishing up police officer and were about to regroup at my location. (My team knew the whole time where I was and what was happening, up until i was shot.)

- I started to barricade myself and told my friends to hurry up. I later was initiated upon by someone outside the building telling me to put my hands up or that i will get shot. (Killing someone must be carried out with high roleplay, “put your hands up or I will shoot” etc is considered low RP and may lead to a ban for RDM/Fail RP.)

- As my life was threatened I opened fire. At the time Zephy was in a Sniping position overseeing the situation. After the shooting started the initiator told me he had friends in the area.

- One out of the opposing team came in through the small sidedoor and he was killed. 

- That same player gives his members tactical information about the situation as heard in the video, 01.40 (http://plays.tv/video/58abbeb8bd156fce1c) ((5.4) When you are revived/downed: You may not actively enter or continue any combat situation for the next 15 minutes. Your character retains all knowledge of the time before they are downed. While you are downed you may not divulge tactical information to anyone. The exception to this is information spoken in direct chat in game.)

- I then get shot by another member of the opposing team.

- Time passes and someone is about to execute me. To make sure the 5 minutes hadnt passed my teammates fired some rounds and also to make them back off from executing me. When I heard the opponents being shot at, therefore I reminded them that I had friends in the area and they should back off or they would get killed.

- The reason for them hearing "microphone muted" from TS is because I have it setup so it mutes when i speak ingame. And I was at the time RPing with the opponents ingame.
---
Below I will try to clearify the issues stated by Sebastian.

1- They didn't warned us about their friends on the area before getting downed.
The rules doesn't clearly state I have to inform them that I have friends in the area since they are the ones initiating upon us. It is his choise to attack us.

2- He was talking with his friends (by ts3) while downed (you can see it that his mic is only getting muted at 5:36).
As explained above my TS mic is setup to toggle mute/unmute when speaking ingame. You can hear it first time at 00.34 (also at 5.35) (http://plays.tv/video/58abbeb8bd156fce1c) because I was about to talk to him but could hear him moving outside so I wanted to hear where he was moving. I didnt give my friends any type of information about the situation after I was downed. When he was about to execute me its common sense to me that I should try to value my life and talk him out of it in any way i can. And as I heard shots being fired upon them I assumed it was my friends OR it was someone else, either way the enemy of my enemy.. as you can hear in the video you clearly hear shots first, then I tell them they should value their life and not execute me (https://youtu.be/HprSamDWeec?t=334 5.32)

3- Only told about their friends when he was downed, at 5:45 and didn't threat us. At 6:11 you can clearly hear shots).
Well, the man asked me a question and I answered it..

4- I dont really believe that you are able to initiate after being downed.
Since I was the one being initiated upon, my gang that is in the situation is also being initiated upon. 

5- Considering that was no initiation, we got RDM'd by Zephy.
The shots fired by Zephy were fired within the 5 minute-rule and as described above, the initiation upon me is also an initiation on the gang.

I hope this answers any questions or doubt you have had about the situation even after resolving it with server staff. 
Personally I just think its a shame that you would go back on the agreement made and agreed upon when the staffmember was in the TS channel. In any way I dont belive that anyone is in the wrong, if so please inform us so we can clearify the situation. To me it all just comes down to common sense, thus noone is to blame.

 

[RendoirS]

Personally I just think its a shame that you would go back on the agreement made and agreed upon when the staffmember was in the TS channel. In any way I dont belive that anyone is in the wrong, if so please inform us so we can clearify the situation. To me it all just comes down to common sense, thus noone is to blame.

I will go back on my word, and i will answer about this, instead of stay quiet cause you are basicly call me a liar and an untrusted man.

"go back on the agreement made"
I agreed that we could discuss when a staff member was on. What we did, and unfortunelly didn't lead to solve the issue. 

I think that i record every ts3 talk somewhere, so if a STAFF asks me for that, i can search it and upload it. 

For the second time on this report, i get called of liar, when YOU (as a gang) lied already on this post.

"We have tried resolving this issue for two days"
This issue happens at 3:30 AM (21/02/2017). Cobra answered yesterday saying that this issue happened 2 days ago. As long as you know, isn't true at all.

" He agreed that our party broke no rules"
Another lie from Cobra, cause i'm pretty sure that Auxen told that you broke rules. I had a chat with him before talk with you, where i show him the video, and he clearly said to me that you broke some rules. He told the same to you, i'm pretty sure.

" Ive spent hours trying to resolve this and nothing seems to satisfy your needs "
I told you what I want, a comp for the gear lost, and as long as i remember you left the voice chat on ts3, so dont say that "nothing seems to satisfy", so one more lie from Cobra

" After around 20 mins at least with @Auxen we come to the conclusion that nothing was gonna happen "
Just get a point, 20 mins or hours ?


I could have called you liar aswell, and i never did, since this is a report to a guy, AS A PLAYER. I never insult you, so i think that you have no right to say anything about me as a person.

So, what i mean by this is:
You are allowed to defend yourselves ofc, and i hope you do so, that's why the reports are public.
Just dont try to verbal abuse someone, accusing him of lie at least 2 times on this post. If you wanna acuse me of something, just post proves of that, instead of being there trying to harass me and trying to make me get a bad reputation.

 

[Chewbastian]

I am pretty sure he said something along the lines of, "put your hands up or you will be shot" 

(7.1.3) Killing someone must be carried out with high roleplay, “put your hands up or I will shoot” etc is considered low RP and may lead to a ban for RDM/Fail RP.

What he said is fail rp aka bad iniciation so there is a problem with his iniciation.

I'm speechless. But I'll explain this to you as simply as I can. Cheslav killed papi because he started shooting. Papi didn't really give any chance for cheslav to continue the initiation in any way. Him saying "put your hands up or you will be shot" is not against the rules. If he had shot Papi right after saying "put your hands up or you will be shot" then that would be against the rules. You must understand this. Like what are you getting at here? Papi was the first one to shoot. Papi got shot because he was shooting at Cheslav. Shooting someone because they are shooting you is not against the rules.

- That same player gives his members tactical information about the situation as heard in the video, 01.40 (http://plays.tv/video/58abbeb8bd156fce1c) ((5.4) When you are revived/downed: You may not actively enter or continue any combat situation for the next 15 minutes. Your character retains all knowledge of the time before they are downed. While you are downed you may not divulge tactical information to anyone. The exception to this is information spoken in direct chat in game.)

That is true. He was in direct chat range so he could have said it in-game. But still he did say it on teamspeak which he shouldn't have. Good catch.

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It is kind of odd that you're saying that you mute your mic with the key you talk in game with. Because the night this all went down you say you dont have your mic hotmiced in ts so why do you have to mute it? I am really confused to be honest. I've had my mic mute/unmute by pressing and releasing capslock and after doing it a couple of times ts blocked my actions for a couple of mins as a spam prevention.

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Yes. The rules do not clearly state that you have to tell you have your friends in the area but your friend who shot us knows that you have to tell that. It's not initiating on the whole gang if we initiate on you. It would make perfect sense if it was considered initiating on the whole gang. But the rules are the rules.

A guy got banned for the same reason last night.

https://www.roleplay.co.uk/topic/81098-report-a-player-mrchee-rdm-action-taken-22022017/

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"as you can hear in the video you clearly hear shots first, then I tell them they should value their life and not execute me "

Nope man. You say you have friends in the area, then we get shot at. Watch cheslav point of view from plays.tv. On that you say that you have friends in the area and before I get to you I say I'm being fired upon.

 

[Just Balls]

the report you posted isnt relevant in this situation m8 and I want to make it clear im calling noone a liar. This is a case of two parties viewing one situation in different ways. Its not my place to call anyone a liar or who is right or not. I am just saying what i believe is right in the situation to defend and explain the reasons of my actions. In the end the admins are the ones who will have the final say.

"I'll still try to explain this to you like you're 5 ", cmon man, this is a mature community please keep it as such.

just to make it clear about the shots.. i was asked why i didnt give up, then i told him i had friends in the area and i made no threats cuz i didnt know if them all were in position. BUT, when the shooting started as I was about to get executed.. then i did threaten sebastians life since he was about to execute me and someone was clearly trying to help me to survive, thru shooting att the opponents. 

I've said all i feel that i need for now and i will await the admins reply to this post. If he/her has any questions i'd love to have the chance to explain them.

Cheers everybody!

 

[Chewbastian]

"I'll still try to explain this to you like you're 5 ", cmon man, this is a mature community please keep it as such.

I didn't mean this in a disrespectful way! ELI5(explain like i'm 5) is a figure of speech from the show "the office" and it has a subreddit based on it. It's just a way to say "I'll explain this to you as simply as I can". Maybe I shouldn't have used the term. I didn't think people wouldn't know it. I'll edit my previous comment.