Report a player - Grove OCG - GTA RP

[Richard]

Report a player 

Your In-game Name: Connor Connards

Name and/or ID of the player(s) you are reporting: Grove OCG

Which server did the incident take place on: GTA RP

Date of the incident: 09/24/23

Time of the incident (GMT) 24hr Format: 1603

What best describes this incident ?: RDM

Please (in detail) describe the incident: On the date above, myself and Busy were casually patrolling; listening to music and minding our own business. We were looking for drug sellers and other people committing motorcycle crime as we do on a day to day basis. We left Little Seoul heading to Mt Haan for dealers. On the way there, we come across motorcycles driving on incorrect lanes of traffic. As such, we light 'em up and they fail to stop. A fairly reasonable pursuit ensued with the BF400 but Vagos vehicles did decide to get involved (found out OOC this was Grove who stole Vagos cars).

Once the BF400 crashes, he instantaneously pulls a firearm and begins shooting. This is where all other who turned up vehicles shoot us as well. Myself and Busy were left defenceless as both our firearms had broken there and then. We were, unsurprisingly, taken and dumped.

During this dumping scenario, we received no RP from the one person in the vehicle and so we respawned.

Link to any evidence (Youtube/Screenshot):



https://youtu.be/w2gU8Hgt5r4



This report is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth!: Yes

You tried to resolve the situation with the player(s) before reporting: No

This is not a revenge report (Abuse will lead to forum/community bans): Yes

 

[Adam Busy]

Here is my POV to aid staff with this one - 

I have nothing further to add unless prompted by staff.
https://medal.tv/games/gta-v/clips/1vwgvnubIOKS3a/d1337TrJda6r?invite=cr-MSxYbXYsNTUwMzUxMjYs
 

 

[Richard]

Forgot to mention that the prior context (or lack of context, shall I say) has been passed to Staff in Ticket #1936.

 

[Bmav]

You were told "If i was yous i wouldn't arrest him", than Adam Busy procceeds to exit his vehicle and tell the person in question to not do any sudden movements. I mean at this point is pretty self explanatory you trying to arrest him so obviously he and we are gonna defend ourselves ? 

To add you ANPRed the bike and noticed the markers, yous said it yourselves it will probably go to a shootout and you were expecting it so why is this being reported, why was there no attempt to solve from you as always from your previous reports and also when are we fine to protect one of our own or retaliate at all or we supposed to just let ourselves be arrested ?

 

[Richard]

Quite frankly Bmav, roleplay recently has been subpar from Grove. I have no obligation to attempt to resolve with a liaison and with the the repeated actions, with what seems like no change from Grove, I do not (and did not) see a need. 

Your comment could've only been heard by Busy,. As seen in my footage, and his, we are not close enough to be heard when talking to each other on normal,  let alone a Jester which is on the other side of him, whispering. After watching his POV, there is an extremely small gap, if one at all, from when the comment of "I don't think you should try arrest him buddy, fuck off."  and when I shout "He's pulling something!" and then shots are fired. That is not quality roleplay. You guys are the ones who pulled guns first. You guys are the ones who decided to shoot first. This means you can't possibly be 'defending' anyone.

You were told "If i was yous i wouldn't arrest him", than Adam Busy procceeds to exit his vehicle and tell the person in question to not do any sudden movements

Your order of events is completely incorrect with Busy actually saying his line, before you.

I will not comment further unless directed to by Staff. This is to prevent the back and forth bickering which tends to happen with Gangs.

 

[Bmav]

Quite frankly Bmav, roleplay recently has been subpar from Grove. I have no obligation to attempt to resolve with a liaison and with the the repeated actions, with what seems like no change from Grove, I do not (and did not) see a need. 

Your comment could've only been heard by Busy,. As seen in my footage, and his, we are not close enough to be heard when talking to each other on normal,  let alone a Jester which is on the other side of him, whispering. After watching his POV, there is an extremely small gap, if one at all, from when the comment of "I don't think you should try arrest him buddy, fuck off."  and when I shout "He's pulling something!" and then shots are fired. That is not quality roleplay. You guys are the ones who pulled guns first. You guys are the ones who decided to shoot first. This means you can't possibly be 'defending' anyone.

Your order of events is completely incorrect with Busy actually saying his line, before you.

I will not comment further unless directed to by Staff. This is to prevent the back and forth bickering which tends to happen with Gangs.

You didn't even speak once OOC with grove at all or attempted to, honestly if you want change than why not mention it instead of going straight to the forums its the only thing you do and it doesn't always benefit the community both Police and gangs need each other to exist banning all of one is not the answer which seems looks its what you looking to do considering your previous reports.

This mentality is exactly whats wrong currently but again its what you want so i will leave it but my point stands both need each other to exist if you dont have any gang you dont have people to arrest and besides personally dont see the rulebreak here mate you tried to arrest someone the evidence is shown clear as day and ended up getting retaliated the only thing i can say is dont expect everyone to roll over and do /e twerk becuase thats the only way you consider it roleplay because you need to get the arrest to RP.

Police command also seem to incentivate this mentality which is a shame so we just stuck in a endless loop of trying to promote dialogue to see what yous as police want and what we as gangs want but it gets denied to even bring a conversation up because you guys seem to think you are the only ones who play the server and your enjoyement is the only thing that matters and fuck the rest basically.

To retify i wasn't the one who pulled the shotgun but i did shoot after bullets were already flying and tbh i dont regret it because i dont think i done anything wrong in protecting my gang members and would do it again same as you would if the roles were reversed and we kidnapped a cop or if shots were already flying between cops and someone else you would shoot that "someone else" as for AJ i can't speak for him but i can see his point of view since he did get told to get out the bike and to not make any sudden movements at that point is pretty obvious he is getting arrested from his point of view so he retaliates so he doesn't get arrested and considering there was alot of us on the scene cops were in no position to be able to arrest him safely.

The only thing that puts me off is that i cannot see a middle ground to this situation, if we tried escaping by just driving we would get rammed of our bikes or completely have our cars rammed, if we retaliate in anyway to protect out gang members we get reported. So the only realistic way i can see of a situation like this ending is with the desired outcome you want of us just getting of the vehicles and doing /e Twerk and just hand ourselves in, even the fact we warned you beforehand that "if i was yous i wouldn't try and arrest him" and you do exactly that of what we threatened you and not only that you also told AJ to get off the bike multiple times and tried to arrest him at the pharmacy by saying "out the bike and don't move", i seriously cannot see why we can't retaliate to help our gang members we made all necessary efforts to make sure you knew we were involved and weren't gonna let that happen and you did know we were all together otherwise police wouldn't have shot the people in the cars/bikes behind you instead they would have shot the one with the shotgun specifically but no they targeted us as a group aswell.

Personally i think it was all fair game, and like i said there was RP even after you were downed you just decided not to go along with it but Ernie (which was the cop that survived the situation) was let go with no consequences besides  his radio, phone and bodycam taken off and he was let in pillbox.
Not to even mention the multiple raids that happened a day before and not to mention the earlier situation where one of us was either arrested or attempted to be arrested by adam busy for sellin on dutch.

Anyway thats all i needed to say, since this is going nowhere i will leave it to staff.

 

[Liam]

You’re right both need to co-exist on the server @Bmavbut if another player feels like there was no roleplay or the roleplay was low quality, they are well within their right to report it.

Let’s start to be mature and civil about this. Forum points will be handed out 

 

[sigmatic]

Hello, I was the bike being chased throughout the video and I'd like to state I don’t believe this to be RDM.

Firstly you can hear the officer straight away ANPR my bike and say “Bruno Clark?” (you know to be grove) and immediately switch to a different freq asking for a Trojan unit stating “we’re chasing a Bruno Clark, he has a previous for firearms offences” “he’s probably got a gun on him, Bruno Clark, well known OCG”. Although it wasn’t Bruno Clark on the bike, you had already made the decision that I would be carrying a firearm showing that you knew that a gunfight was likely in the lane of RP you chose to go down.

It is well know that Grove had altercations with the police about 30 mins - 1 hour before this, as well as yesterday and multiple times in the last couple of weeks, there is plenty of backstory as to why we immediately get hostile towards officers (and you knew it was grove as you called out the bikes owner - people you have been looking for a while). At 1:57 into the video, Adam Busy can be heard stating “I don’t really plan on losing anything today" which reaffirms what I said in the previous paragraph about knowingly heading towards a gun fight.

At 2:15, Busy then states “this vehicle is failing to stop, suspect he may have a firearm or something else on his possession, OCG member Bruno Clark, [insert police coms here], high risk of a shoot”. Further showing both yourself and Busy were preparing for a gunfight no matter how things went.

At 3:13, Busy then decides to say “it appears the vehicle is going to keep doing loops, so he can get rammed”, and shortly after this at 3:44 in the clip Busy stated I had been “took off”. Now, at this point, I believe that I had been rammed off the bike by officers, it wasn’t until seeing your POV that I realised I had been rammed by a local (You could have shown me in liaison). This was completely my fault and honestly a simple human error, had I known in the moment that it was a local that hit me and not a police officer, I would not have taken out my gun before trying to talk first (I believed the police engaged in lethal action, as I had been taken off my bike at speed). However, this was a situation that you and Adam Busy have shown throughout both your POV's that you were expecting anyway (a gunfight). This still does not excuse that I should not have shot since it wasn't a police officer who rammed me off my bike, and I was not eager to just escalate things hence the long lasting chase.

All in all, with the context of police trying to find grove members and not trying to engage in any RP rather than yelling at us to turn our car/bike off and get out, coupled with the fact I was circling areas which you could obviously see a lot of people definitely associated with me in cars people typically use to shoot out of I think you full well knew this was a likely outcome and it was not random at all.

I believe that shots were already being fired anyway, as you can hear in Adam Busy's POV, before I even got my shotgun out. The police were also warned multiple times not to try arrest me (it can be heard once in Adam Busy's clip towards the end, however other officers than the 2 POV's given had also received warnings). As a gang member my only objective in this RP was to get away from the police after a fun chase, or hopefully take some of them hostage/dodgy doctor to roleplay, as I was carrying illegal items and no criminal wants to go to jail.

As for the lack of RP, we were trying to find a dodgy doctor for a very long time but we were unfortunately not able to find one. The only officer that was offering us RP was the front line officer, I know that Adam Busy or yourself immediately typed "/me unresponsive" once you were placed into a vehicle with another grove member - how exactly are we meant to roleplay with someone who is unresponsive?

I would have appreciated the opportunity to speak about this with yourselves in a liaison before immediately jumping to a report as I feel as though this could have been resolved very easily, however I just feel like you just wanted to report no matter even though you yourself could see this as the likely outcome, as you were obviously outnumbered and putting your own selves at great danger (you did notice the other BF400, another bike and multiple cars following).

I've just noticed at the end, that you have titled the video: "The norm from grove" which just tells a lot about your mentality going into this situation, immediately seeing the bike is owned by grove and all your actions showing you were expecting a gun fight.

 

[Bmav]

I would like to point out aswell that you didnt get dumped , you were in our vehicle and you were being spoken to in the meantime of us driving around but not once did we dump you unnattended you were with us until you respawned and died in our car, and as for the RP part i can tell you that we were indeed RPing through the entire situation including when you were injured.

Also like AJ pointed we also heard yous saying you were gonna ram him of the bike aswell and coupled with telling him to pull over and get out the bike and also tell him to not move once he got out the bike at pharmacy, which again proves my point of there being an active situation

 

[Adam Busy]

I will happily reply to this as there is quite a bit of information directed towards myself and quite clearly misinterpreted as well and will address in chronological order and would like to address facts instead of hearsay.

"a firearm showing that you knew that a gunfight was likely in the lane of RP you chose to go down."

I personally didn't choose this route, I got shot after I exited my car unfortnuately.

It is well know that Grove had altercations with the police about 30 mins - 1 hour before this

Didn't have a clue about this to be honest and although context matters at the same time every situation a decent level of rp should be given/exchanged instead of shooting without having any form of verbal communication with the other party or changing it up and make the scenario unique as this is something that is sadly too common nowadays.

At 1:57 into the video, Adam Busy can be heard stating “I don’t really plan on losing anything today" which reaffirms what I said in the previous paragraph about knowingly heading towards a gun fight.

Unless your meaning of "losing anything today" is different to mine, within an RP capacity I didn't intend on losing the vehicle that failed to stop for me. Bit of a stretch but hopefully that clarifies your understanding/misinterpretation. As a cop I would preferably catch the car that is failing to stop for myself than loose it and I think common sense would also dictate that.

At 2:15, Busy then states “this vehicle is failing to stop, suspect he may have a firearm or something else on his possession, OCG member Bruno Clark, [insert police coms here], high risk of a shoot”. Further showing both yourself and Busy were preparing for a gunfight no matter how things went.

I said "High-risk Pursuit", as we do in real life and on the server we determine and manage risk within RP and declare if a pursuit should be Low, Med, High. Due to the circumstances within RP this was a high-risk pursuit. I did not say "shoot" so again hopefully this reaffirms your current understanding. I can confirm I love a good car chase, but stating we were preparing for a gunfight is harsh. I completely agree that we were taking precautions to manage risk as recently this is the sort of outcome that happens, we end up getting shot however this isn't always the case and therefore need to adapt to the situation is present. 

At 3:13, Busy then decides to say “it appears the vehicle is going to keep doing loops, so he can get rammed”, and shortly after this at 3:44 in the clip Busy stated I had been “took off”. Now, at this point, I believe that I had been rammed off the bike by officers, it wasn’t until seeing your POV that I realised I had been rammed by a local (You could have shown me in liaison). This was my bad and a simple human error, had I known in the moment that it was a local that hit me and not a police officer, I would not have taken out my gun before trying to talk first (I believed the police engaged in lethal action, as I had been taken off my bike at speed). However, this was a situation that you and Adam Busy have shown throughout both your POV's that you were expecting anyway (a gunfight).

"So we can get rammed", as it is a common meta, we often have cars intervene with pursuits with intent and just drive into us, it was clear to us that when the bike started to loop a particular area and more vehicles attended this was going to potentially put us at further risk and indeed it did. 

I have indeed stated you were 'took off' as someone hit you off of your motorcycle, unfortunately, you chose to take the action you did by shooting instantly after we attempted to speak with you. 

I personally do think that things should and indeed could have been done better but far more commonly now this seems to be happening, if this is the standard of RP that we can expect from our average pursuit I can personally say it is very demotivating and I think everyone here knows that this could have been handled better in terms of the opportunities of the outcome. 

Yes you are in an OCG and there are 'previous incidents' that make you more volatile towards police however does this excuse / give more discretion for shooting quicker after police interaction, I don't think that is personally a reasonable justification as there are other people on the server that are in the same position currently and before with the police yet have still found ways to provide interesting and creative RP instead of shooting after the chase has 'ended' and then shouting 'you're a mong'.

Again, hopefully, this can provide some clarity for your misunderstanding and I will leave this entry here for staff to read. I do not wish to write anything more and hopefully, my perspective can aid a meaningful outcome once reviewed.

All the best,
 

 

[sigmatic]

I personally didn't choose this route, I got shot after I exited my car unfortnuately.
 

You instantly called for firearms backup?

I have indeed stated you were 'took off' as someone hit you off of your motorcycle, unfortunately, you chose to take the action you did by shooting instantly after we attempted to speak with you. 
 

I believed it was a police car that rammed me off at the time, and I already heard gunshots, so I wanted to defend myself using the shotgun. It would have been stupid of my character to have thought that after being hit by a police car, then hearing gunshots, to attempt to speak to the police who were also taking their firearms out.

I personally do think that things should and indeed could have been done better but far more commonly now this seems to be happening, if this is the standard of RP that we can expect from our average pursuit I can personally say it is very demotivating and I think everyone here knows that this could have been handled better in terms of the opportunities of the outcome. 

Yes you are in an OCG and there are 'previous incidents' that make you more volatile towards police however does this excuse / give more discretion for shooting quicker after police interaction, I don't think that is personally a reasonable justification as there are other people on the server that are in the same position currently and before with the police yet have still found ways to provide interesting and creative RP instead of shooting after the chase has 'ended' and then shouting 'you're a mong'.
 

I was not the one insulting you, however your instant call for firearms and your "unresponsive" /me makes me feel as if you are just contradicting yourself, you obviously expected a gun fight, and it just seems that you have an issue with me pulling my gun out, although shots had already been fired before I did so.

We were happy to provide RP, however if I stopped my bike I would have been arrested, I was just trying to buy time for everyone to get setup to have a good situation, and we could have had a good hostage scenario however it was impossible to do so considering the "/me unresponsive" and what I believe to be no other interactions from yourself.

I really believe that this situation could have been avoided if we went into a liaison to talk it out rather than going straight to a report, as I think that the actions I took were reasonable whilst believing that it was a police officer who rammed me off my bike, as well as shots being fired before mine.

 

[Bmav]

You’re right both need to co-exist on the server @Bmavbut if another player feels like there was no roleplay or the roleplay was low quality, they are well within their right to report it.

Let’s start to be mature and civil about this. Forum points will be handed out 

Never said it isn't his right just saying (whithout trying to be a cunt) that him specifically always refuses to speak to get someone else's point of view.

Its a diffrent style i am used to (even being here for 2 years, in the previous community i was in that was basically an oligation before reporting and imo its how it should be and if the same person repeats that same action than yes i agree 100% if they are not learning than they need punishing, but going straight to forums without any sort of solving even in here he refuses to reply after one single reply, thats my point of view on things and i am pretty sure you understand what i mean Liam.

Also to add further again into the fact of apparently us dumping, we left the last cop that was injurer in the car with us at hospital, and only took his bodycam, radio and phone so this couldnt be further from the truth since we gave police as a whole a oppurtunity to strike back.
Would like to point out if you are gonna complain about someone saying at the end "You are a mong" than don't say that in RP to us aswell, i just returned the same line you have used when you arrested us on Dutch london like 2 days before this incident, and again its all RP we are gang members i am not supposed to go to you and say you want some ice cream and a cup of milk.

 

[Adam Busy]

For staff awareness, this was a PM conversation held. If this could also please be read.

Cheers,

#

In terms of the last entry for 'injury rp' I would prefer that this report stays on topic. If you feel as if something was done wrongfully raise it accordingly in the proper manner and I will happily elaborate.

Have a good evening.

 

[sigmatic]

A bit childish that you ended my attempt at talking to you about it by telling me you’re screenshotting our dm’s to post on forums after I respond to your accusation of poor RP by mentioning (something I have previously mentioned in this report) that you didn’t allow us to RP with you by being unresponsive the entire time, purely as i’m curious as to what you would expect. I guess it’s just up to staff whatever the outcome.

 

[Jessie Bennett]

Your report is currently being reviewed, Please be patient while the evidence is reviewed

Please keep checking this report regularly just in case the reviewing staff member has any questions

Thank you for your report and you doing your part to keep our community clean!

 

[Jessie Bennett]

Good evening @Richard 

Thank you for the report.

I have not reviewed this alone, but with a couple of other staff members too and we've all come to the same conclusion after looking at all the evidence.

The roleplay provided here during the scenario was not high quality at all.
As a community leader (Gang Leader) we would be expecting a lot more roleplay than shooting at the officers when the pursuit came to a stop. 

As per the G1.2 "Attacking another player without engaging in any form of quality roleplay is considered RDM".
I am not seeing any form of the quality roleplay provided by yourself before shooting the officers outside of the pharmacy.

CharID: 49450
Action: 1 week (following FBS)
Rule(s)broken: G1.2 / G1.7

 

[Jessie Bennett]

Thank you for doing your part in keeping the community clean.

Your report has been approved and action has been taken against the reported player.

If you are out of pocket due to this case please now open a compensation request here, Do make sure to mention this report.