Report a Player - Zeph - (Rejected)

[Haywire]

Your In-game name

Haywire

Name of the player(s) you are reporting

Zeph

Date of the incident

04/26/2017

Time of the incident (GMT)

50

What best describes this incident ?

RDM

Which server did the incident take place on

Server 1

Please (in detail) describe the incident

We notice a red hatchback sport that had been weirdly tailing us from the airport. We see it parked up on the hill that oversees Wilcochem and decided to find out what his intentions were and take away his rifle. We initiate on him, after a good few seconds he exists the car and tries to kill us but he is unsuccessful. We kill him. He doesn't say a word. We head down to the Wilcochem and begin a new situation and process our meth. Aproximately 3 minutes and 30 seconds later, we are shot at without any words spoken whatsoever and killed.

Video Timestamps:

0:00 - Rolling up to the suspicious car to box him in
0:16 - Initiating on the man in the car
0:42 - Last shot fired - man in the car killed
0:59 - Man was executed
(next few minutes is us driving to wilchochem and processing meth)
4:13 - We begin getting shot at and killed

It's important to watch the whole video to get the full idea of what happened. We attempted to resolve the situation with those involved on teamspeak however at first they denied any rule breaking. After speaking with two members of staff we were told that the roleplay was non-existent and there was a breach of the following rule: (7.1.3) Killing someone must be carried out with high roleplay, “put your hands up or I will shoot” etc is considered low RP and may lead to a ban for RDM/Fail RP. We spoke to those involved again after speaking with the staff and requested compensation. This time, they were more willing to provide some comp however they wanted to get more staff assurance and still didn't believe they were in violation of the rules. After a couple hours trying to resolve this and getting nowhere, we have made a report as advised by the member support team. I hope this gives Zeph a fair chance to defend his honour and the opportunity for members of the staff team to give their opinion on it.

Link to any evidence (Youtube/Screenshot)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pzccBOWMab4&feature=youtu.be&ab_channel=hatchingdraggon
This report is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth!

Yes

You tried to resolve the situation with the player(s) before reporting

Yes

This is not a revenge report (Abuse will lead to forum/community bans)

Yes

 

[ZephyOG]

? to all staff.

What do you think about this situation, if I were to tell you we had eyes on the whole time and one of our gang members witnessed Ghostkiller being executed? The video of that isn't available right now as that member of the evidence is offline but later on today I am sure that can be provided. But given the situation what do you think?

I'd also like to link this :



In this report, the guy does not say he has any friends in the area but yet we all get killed by his friends as they were led into a trap.... Also I would like to say @ApexNetworks said in the video, "He didn't say anything". Well same as this situation, accept that it was allowed and that report got denied so this makes me very confused and makes me need extra assurance.

In my opinion this is the same scenario, we had our gang member on over watch to see where the trucks were going, if they were to drive off he would of engaged but he seen them turn into WilcoChem so that is when I come in around the back and he has front compound control and I then have the back compound control, therefore they are trapped. 

Can I also get some sort of assurance on whether the guy initiating has to say he has friends in the area, and that the guy being initiated on doesn't have to say he has friends in the area as some staff have different opinions on that.

If I am wrong I am more than happy to compensate these gentlemen, I really wanted other staff's opinion on it as @JohnJoeegan and @Smith were the only guys to comment on what happened but after speaking to @Busterguy this was suggested.

After a couple hours trying to resolve this and getting nowhere

Well I wanted to also speak with the Admins you guys talked to as it would of been unfair but I guess now other admins can have their say as some will have different opinions on these types of situations.

Tagging involved players so they can also comment on the situation...

@GHOSTK1LL3R

@PalmtreeWhale

 

[GHOSTK1LL3R]

Howdy there,

I personally don't see the issue with what has occurred Palm (Joseph) had full eyes on the whole situation that occurred. When I got executed which he saw he then saw everyone get inside their hemmits. Once they got in he knew that if he engaged there and then it was unlikely he would be able to remove all 4 threats from the situation. Due to this, when he saw them pull up on the compound not 600 meters from where I met my death he decided that it was best to wait a couple of moments for Zephy to move up on foot and they'd both push from both sides of the compound.

You can see from Haywires video that he was aware of what would occur because you can hear asking if they should hide the hemmits behind wilcochem.

I don't understand how Palm not shooting straight away but rather waiting for those in the hemmits to foolishly go into a compound not 500meters away  of which is apparently poor roleplay? It was Palm playing smart and waiting for back-up to get into the right position and moving in at the right time. @Smith @JohnJoeegan .

As shown the video, not 5 minutes went past and both Zephy and Palm were aware of that which is why they didn't re-initiate.

 

[Haywire]

Howdy there,

I personally don't see the issue with what has occurred Palm (Joseph) had full eyes on the whole situation that occurred. When I got executed which he saw he then saw everyone get inside their hemmits. Once they got in he knew that if he engaged there and then it was unlikely he would be able to remove all 4 threats from the situation. Due to this, when he saw them pull up on the compound not 600 meters from where I met my death he decided that it was best to wait a couple of moments for Zephy to move up on foot and they'd both push from both sides of the compound.

You can see from Haywires video that he was aware of what would occur because you can hear asking if they should hide the hemmits behind wilcochem.

I don't understand how Palm not shooting straight away but rather waiting for those in the hemmits to foolishly go into a compound not 500meters away  of which is apparently poor roleplay? It was Palm playing smart and waiting for back-up to get into the right position and moving in at the right time. @Smith @JohnJoeegan .

As shown the video, not 5 minutes went past and both Zephy and Palm were aware of that which is why they didn't re-initiate.




 

Like mentioned in the report - the problem was not that 5 minutes hadn't passed (this rule actually isn't stated anywhere) the problem is that there was no roleplay from anyone in ascension. If you had got out of the car and said something along the lines of, "I have people in the area, let me go right now or they'll get you" then the killing at the meth dealer would have been justified. We initiated on a single person, we could not see anyone else in the area and the person we initiated on didn't say a word to us. Zeph killed us when we were in a different situation happily chatting away whilst processing meth.

Put it this way. If we had seen Zeph sneaking up on wilcochem and we just shot him without saying a word, is that RDM? I'd like to think it is. What if some armed rebels happen to walk by, can we kill them too because they might have been associated with a guy we killed 3 minutes ago? I would hope not. We initiated on a single man in a single car, we killed him and that situation ended after the killing shot. There was no indication that anyone else was in the area, no words spoken, no shots fired and we had no visuals. 

This is a roleplay server. From a combat perspective, what you did would make sense if it was in the redzone or wasteland. 

 

[JohnJoeegan]

Hey gents, when I'm back from work and have my notes I'll post my view on the situation

 

[GHOSTK1LL3R]

Like mentioned in the report - the problem was not that 5 minutes hadn't passed (this rule actually isn't stated anywhere) the problem is that there was no roleplay from anyone in ascension.

I personally find it hypocrtial of you saying that there was no roleplay with us when as soon as you pull up to me at my hatchpack you instantly threaten my life and then proceed to shoot my tires out.

If you had got out of the car and said something along the lines of, "I have people in the area, let me go right now or they'll get you" then the killing at the meth dealer would have been justified. We initiated on a single person, we could not see anyone else in the area and the person we initiated on didn't say a word to us.

With you initiating on myself, I have been informed many times from many admins. That I don't need to state I have my friends in the area and due to this, I didn't. You assumed you initiated on a single person but you in reality initiated on my whole gang which was your fault for forcing the initiation and not waiting. You could of just spoken to me and asked why I was there and who I was with. Instead you're saying to me get out without a gun or die.

Zeph killed us when we were in a different situation happily chatting away whilst processing meth.

Not trying to be rude here but it's not our fault that you're oblivious to killing me and then thinking you could drive straight to the wilcochem which is only 600m away. You should of drove away like you intended to.

Put it this way. If we had seen Zeph sneaking up on wilcochem and we just shot him without saying a word, is that RDM? I'd like to think it is. What if some armed rebels happen to walk by, can we kill them too because they might have been associated with a guy we killed 3 minutes ago?

Why not? Palm had the ability to shoot you instantly as you shot me. However, he chose to wait for Zephy to come over. He knew that he would have 5 minutes until he'd have to reinitiate they waited and used what they had to their advantage.

I would hope not. We initiated on a single man in a single car, we killed him and that situation ended after the killing shot. There was no indication that anyone else was in the area, no words spoken, no shots fired and we had no visuals. 

We didn't need to give visuals or let you know I had friends in the area. You messed up, thinking you could get away with killing me and then decided to continue what you were doing 600meters away from what just occurred.

This is a roleplay server. From a combat perspective, what you did would make sense if it was in the redzone or wasteland. 

I understand this is a roleplay server but it's not my fault you decided to instantly initiate on my life as soon as you got out the trucks. You didn't even speak to me nor about who/why I was there you just straight up wanted to kill me. You can say what we did would make sense if it was redzone or wasteland but what you did was no better.

 

[Haywire]

I'm not going to try and quote everything you said there but some basic points:

- We didn't 'want' to kill you. We assumed you would value your life in roleplay and get out of the car so we could talk to you. The idea was find out what your intentions were, take away your rifle and let you be on your way. We shot your tires when you were refusing to get out of the car (I gave you plenty of warning before shooting your tires) and this was to stop you driving away and getting some cover to attack us.

- I understand what you're saying about admins allowing gang members to defend their gang member without initiation. However, I'm fairly sure that this only applies in certain situations where it's down to common sense and you should always try to make people aware that you have people in the area. With this being a roleplay server, I can see no way that what happened here is acceptable.

- The only reason that this turned into a report is because we lost a lot. I'm not just talking about the gear, but our night was cut short because of this. What's more is we were taking a new player who was asking for help in sidechat with us and we wanted to get him some starter money and introduce him to the server. If what happened last night is his first impression on the server, then I wouldn't expect him to be coming back. I strongly believe that these kinds of minimalistic roleplay scenarios shouldn't be tolerated in a community that prides itself on a high level of RP.  

Without being rude, you know where I stand and I know where you stand. I'm going to hold off responding on here unless staff request it, there's enough for them to read through as it is.

 

[ApexNetworks]

As I was overlooking this situation in game and in teamspeak I can't understand what rules have been broke from Zephy's side, you initiated which means he does not have to declare he has friends in the area, and it was within 5 minutes? Both the fights was right next to each other meaning it was the same situation? Maybe if you talked to him insted of initiated on him he would have rped with you. He was only there to see what you was doing and TAX you 25% for protection. As that's our standard terms of robbing.

 

[ZephyOG]

@Gregory What are your thoughts on this?

 

[Robbie]

Firstly. Can you please stop tagging multiple staff members in to view the report. @JohnJoeegan has already said he will be dealing with this. 

 

[Haywire]

I was contacted by Zeph 10 minutes ago and we spoke on teamspeak about this report. He was happy that there was a violation of the rules and agreed to compensate us. Because we could sort things out, I'd like to request that this report doesn't go any further.

I'm glad we could sort things out, thanks a lot to Zeph for contacting me about it ^

 

[JohnJoeegan]

I'm glad you managed to resolve the matter at hand. Report rejected.