Report a player - Unknown ID - Bill White - GTA RP

[Anonymous Monkey]

Report a player 

Your In-game Name: Anonymous Monkey

Name and/or ID of the player(s) you are reporting: Unknown ID - Bill White

Which server did the incident take place on: GTA RP

Date of the incident: 07/25/22

Time of the incident (GMT) 24hr Format: 1710

What best describes this incident ?: NVL - Win Mentality

Please (in detail) describe the incident: For the first time in a few weeks, I decided to play my criminal character again. I decided on using a 'different' method of taking a police officer hostage. I pulled a sawn-off out of my house and got onto my BF400 with the main intention of taking a police officer hostage using the backseat.

I found the perfectly positioned officer, and pointed the shotgun directly at his head, the officer stalled for a moment and got onto the bike.

Due to SERVER limitations, you PHYSICALLY cannot point the firearm backwards at him, nor shoot him at this point. The reported party took advantage of this server limitation and used that opportunity to press his panic button, get off the bike, and then pull a stun-gun out of his pockets.

I would like to question why it was this officers complete and utter intention to have me arrested over valuing his life, like really? Taser vs Shotgun?

In the clip below, you can see the officer blatantly not value his life, and demonstrated a deep down win mentality overall. This situation completely demotivated me in respect of playing on a criminal character. I did not attempt to resolve this with the other party as this is not the first time something like this has happened, just the first time I have managed to clip it.

PS: Sorry about my breathing lol, was ill & had my mic way too close to my mouth.

Link to any evidence (Youtube/Screenshot):

[REMOVED]
This report is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth!: Yes

You tried to resolve the situation with the player(s) before reporting: No

This is not a revenge report (Abuse will lead to forum/community bans): Yes

 

[Anonymous Monkey]

I have spoken to Bill in teamspeak after this situation, and I would like this report to remain open for a discussion involving staff. I personally do not believe that Bill sees what he has done wrong here and we would both like an opinion from the staff team.

 

[M]

Can the staff have a longer video to show the full context of the situation please?

 

[Bowen]

Message from Anonymous Monkey on this matter:

"im away on a trip until tomo or day after with work and won't be able to provide a clip until then, thanks"

 

[Astrid Belski]

Longer video submitted by Anonymous Monkey via the ticket system.

 

[M]

My position is that this is not NVL, but a report that has been fuelled by the reporter’s past experiences with police officers and lack of critical thinking.

The attacker was solo on a motorcycle as far as I was aware. I had no roleplay interaction with them prior to them drawing a shotgun on me. 
 

Taking into consideration my characters objectives and training, I jumped off of the bike and pressed my panic button in a natural attempt to escape.

The reporter is clearly adamant that they are wholly right in the situation with no compromise for where they made mistakes in their MO. Their MO is where I take issue with the meaning of obvious disadvantage with respect to the rules of NVL.

As I was dealing with a person on the road side and other officers had recently stood down, I know that they are in the immediate vicinity. Therefore I called for assistance. This is valuing my life as to be taken away defenceless would weaken my opportunity of escape, which is natural for my character to do. 
 

The argument that he can’t point a shotgun backwards at me is flawed. The attacker is operating a motorcycle. They have opted by choice to attempt to take me hostage, un-restrained, and have me sit with my open hands happily behind them, whilst their back is to me. Here is a non-exhaustive list of things that could have been done in real life, seen as you are so keen to mention server limitations:

- Pulled my pistol out of my holster and shot you in the back as you are not looking.

- Strangulated you before or during riding.

- Caused the bike to tip whilst riding causing us both to crash.

- Tickled you off the bike

- Gave you a 2 back and sides whilst riding…

Not to mention your expectation of being able to operate a motorcycle, whilst holding a shotgun in your right hand, pay attention to the road, and observe me to make sure I am not doing any of the above. Talk about physically not being able to do something…

I think your argument is flawed in its logic and seeks to scapegoat the first cop who doesn’t allow you to win in your ridiculous plan that you must have put so much time and thought into with those weeks off.

In respect to pulling the taser, it was accidental. It should have been a glock but had pulled the wrong one on the weapon wheel. Server limitations I guess, you can’t blame me for my own errors.

Your argument is a warped interpretation of the rules at best. It is bent to your advantage to enable you to be lauded as someone who should have won, rather than someone who lost as a result of their own poor planning. 
 

I have already admitted in TeamSpeak that there are always areas of improvement in my roleplay. Yes I could have done things differently. But the course of action I took was on my best knowledge of the rules. I don’t seek to be right or wrong in this. I’m being critical of your report. I’d happily take on board any further criticism by the staff member dealing with this report.

 

[Drex]

Posted on behalf of Anonymous Monkey via ticket system
REF: #Forums-1242

Good Morning Bill, hope all is well, and thank you for the reply on this report!
Just had a read through your POV here, and I would like to comment on some of the points that you have brought up.

My position is that this is not NVL, but a report that has been fuelled by the reporter’s past experiences with police officers and lack of critical thinking.

I'm not really sure how this can be seen that you did not NVL at all here, you clearly made some decisions that resulted in you inevitable death, seems like NVL to me. Glock vs Shotgun when you got off of the bike?

 

The attacker was solo on a motorcycle as far as I was aware. I had no roleplay interaction with them prior to them drawing a shotgun on me. 

In your eyes, I may have been 'solo' but that doesn't mean I was? And even IF I was, a shotgun vs a glock, I think the shotgun would win 200x over. Also, since when was 'previous roleplay interaction' required to begin a robbery? You CANCELLED out all further roleplay that we could have had by getting off of the bike and pressing your panic button, therefore have only yourself to blame in retrospect.

 

Taking into consideration my characters objectives and training, I jumped off of the bike and pressed my panic button in a natural attempt to escape

The natural 'attempt to escape' sounds to me like the win mentality that has been growing recently across RPUK, and there is NO reason why you could not have rped that situation out as losing, since you were at an obvious disadvantage.

 

The reporter is clearly adamant that they are wholly right in the situation with no compromise for where they made mistakes in their MO. Their MO is where I take issue with the meaning of obvious disadvantage with respect to the rules of NVL.

I am fully aware of the GAMEPLAY mistakes that I have made, however not sure how that is relevant here? Did I break any rules? If so, please go ahead and file a separate report on me.


 

The argument that he can’t point a shotgun backwards at me is flawed. The attacker is operating a motorcycle. They have opted by choice to attempt to take me hostage, un-restrained, and have me sit with my open hands happily behind them, whilst their back is to me.

This is completely wrong in my opinion, indeed, I was on a motorcycle, does that mean that you are not STILL at risk? I have a sawn off shotgun, you have a pistol. Roleplay your FEAR. All of these list of things you mentioned here are correct, yet once again, you having the backend URGE to win the situation.

 

I think your argument is flawed in its logic and seeks to scapegoat the first cop who doesn’t allow you to win in your ridiculous plan that you must have put so much time and thought into with those weeks off.

Scapegoat the first cop? hahahaha, this is not the first time this has happened, just the first time I've recorded it. I'm fed up of police thinking it is okay to ruin others roleplay over just wanting to win, and nothing else.

 

[M]

I did not cancel the roleplay. I altered the course of roleplay. By playing the role of a police officer. Someone who is trained to an authorised firearms level. Someone who will not willingly surrender their equipment.

My characters initial compliance demonstrates my valuing of life. I had a shotgun to me. The balance changed when you disadvantaged yourself, your own actions disadvantaged you.

You’re playing rock, paper, scissors with shotguns, pistols, and tasers. It’s an oversimplification and generalisation of the circumstances intended to mislead staff and a wilful misinterpretation of the rules.

The outcome, being shot, is not proof that I did not value my life. The question is whether I was right with consideration to my characters construction and role, the present threat at the time of action, and the factors in my favour. I roleplayed by resisting. It is not a win mentality. It’s a calculated act to divert the course of roleplay. Whether the staff believe that I was sound in my decision is up to them. I stand by my decision.
 

I’ll leave this for staff to decide if you have no further comments to contribute. You are restating your broken argument.

 

[Sammy]

Very well, let´s go ahead and sort this out.

I will start off with something that is being mentioned more and more: win mentality. 
Anonymous Monkey you are correct in saying that it is something that is very present all around and I am certain we all had our fair share of frustration over this issue. However, the rules that are set in place, are partially there to cancel as much of that out as we possibly can, without spoon feeding roleplay to every single person. I can see and appreciate the fact that you attempted to go with a different style of kidnapping here and understand how it can be off putting to not have it work out as envisioned. 

Now onto the footage. It is noticeable that you have attempted to make an interesting RP scenario and go out of the usual boundaries to create such. From a player perspective, it would have been nice for @Mto play along and see where it is going. And here comes the but - although I believe that you Anonymous Monkey have thought through the roleplay you wanted to follow up with, the execution of the kidnapping was not thought out too well. From a rules point of view, him getting on your bike and then pressing the panic was nothing that would be warranting a punishment. He was sitting behind you, as you would have needed to prioritise keeping your eyes on the road to not get yourself in serious harm, and there was a multitude of actions he could have taken, if we want to compare this to real life scenarios. Tipping the bike or pulling a gun or knife out on you being just a few of them... This has not much to do with game mechanics at this point, it is indeed the case of you simply not being able to have proper control of his actions, once he was sat directly behind yourself.

Even if you were able to drive somewhat safely with one hand, while keeping a shotgun to his face, there is no way you would have been able to see directly behind your back to make sure he does not do a sneaky panic press or pulls out a knife and puts it into your kidney. This in combination with the fact that it was a police officer, who is trained for all sorts of situations, clearly armed in one way or another and is aware of other officers being just around the corner, and not just some innocent civilian who might be scared to no end at the possibility of dying, just does not tip this scenario in your favour. 

Long story short, no rules were broken in this specific scenario. What I would like to mention however is the fact that we all are here to roleplay and experience new things. Please keep that in mind for the future @M, as sometimes it can actually be a great interaction for yourself to just play along and not act completely logical. 

I hope that you are not going to give up on attempting to create unique situations and scenarios for yourself and others Anonymous Monkey. Be the change you want to see. You are not the only one trying and walking away frustrated here and there, but when it actually does pan out, it usually makes up for all that and maybe even teaches some people a thing or two! 

Report declined.

 

[Sammy]

Thank you for your report, Unfortunately, it has been declined

The staff member will advise shortly why on this occasion they have declined to take action against the reported player.

Please do not let this put you off making further reports in the future, We rely on our player base to help keep our community clean.