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Report a Player - INS Hontah - Other (Denied)

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jaxiemaxie

jaxiemaxie

Member
Your In-game name

jaxiemaxie

Name of the player(s) you are reporting

INS Hontah

Date of the incident

01/12/2017

Time of the incident (GMT)

2300

What best describes this incident ?

Other

Which server did the incident take place on

Server 2

Please (in detail) describe the incident

Reporting for metagaming. Searching our trucks without evidence. Together with a friend we were doing a heroine run. Video starting just outside Kavala, when we were entering. At 0:22 was first sight of police in Kavala, at this moment there could have been no evidence there was drugs inside the truck or that we were selling drugs. At 4:50 there was a 2nd sighting of police in Kavala, as seen in the video i checked the car and there was an civilian inside. (No cop, so still no evidence) After selling for a 2nd time, at 5:38 there was a 3rd sighting of police in Kavala and already 1 officer (being INS Hontah) at our trucks with our wheels destroyed. While i was storing money on the bank, i got the bounty of being wanted for drug trafficking. This was the first evidence of searching our truck, but since our trucks were already in custody by police the evidence came after they had our trucks.

My friend who came running to the trucks after our wheels were broken and before we were wanted for drug trafficking stayed in RP (since this is an RP server) and told me he tried to solve the rulebreaking like this.

I went on TS and talked to a staff member. He told me without evidence of us doing drugruns the officer was not allowed to do this, but i had to try and solve it with INS Hontah first. Talking on discord with my friend making sure i had the right officer, i send him a message on TS and later went in a room with 2 other officers talking about this. They told me they had enough evidence yet couldnt give me anything. They said they used a drone and saw us running back and forth. When i asked for evidence of them actually using the drone at that moment seeing atleast our trucks standing there before our wheels were broken all i got was 2 screenshots of us being wanted for drug trafficking (as showing in video this came after they already had our trucks) and a picture of a drone. (http://i.imgur.com/p7ijeHh.png) INS Hontah brought another officer (also staff member) in the room. Then they started telling me they dont need evidence and just them saying so is enough. Since they kept saying this and didnt gave me evidence, i told them i would just do the report and compensation request on the forum and seeing then what will happen. An actually ban is not needed as long as there can be compensation. (I will put a link to this in my compensation request, for the money we lost check my comp request.) As seen in the video, i kept checking my surroundings making sure no one was following me. (cops or people who wanna rob us)

Link to any evidence (Youtube/Screenshot)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VV_rVQZCm0
This report is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth!

Yes

You tried to resolve the situation with the player(s) before reporting

Yes

This is not a revenge report (Abuse will lead to forum/community bans)

Yes

 
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We did speak to ConnorTheGreatt and TomTheDoge, we did resolve it as there is no metagaming whatsoever. We were speaking with ConnortheGreatt at first then mr jaxie wanted another staff member so TomTheDoge came and confirmed that no server rules were broken.

I haven't met you ingame either so I don't know how I could have metagamed you. You were also seen by Sanders running up and down from your truck to the drug dealer. ConnorTheGreatt questioned the drug dealer and we got 2 names JaxieMaxie and KALASHNIKOV so we ran the registration on the vehciles and they both came up and you both were wanted from Drug Trafficing so we decided we have more than enough reasons to search your trucks.

I'm not gonna say anything more as I've said before that Both ConnorTheGreatt and TomTheDoge confirmed we stuck by the server rules.

Small update: just because you don't see us doesn't mean we don't see you, thats the whole point of surveillence is not being seen.

 
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I really do not see any rule breaks in this video from our patrol. We see a vehicle suspiciously parked 200m away from the Kavala Drug dealer, we spike the truck in case of someone coming over and driving off. We stop civilians in the area who were walking towards the drug dealer and back again. Took the approprte actiaions from what was in the vehicle following Police Guidelines in the server rules.  

jaxiemaxie said:
(http://i.imgur.com/p7ijeHh.png)




 
Click to expand...
Also just for the staff member reading this report, the image is representing what type of equipment the police have.

 
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http://plays.tv/video/5878ff2f1a106cb200/report-13-1

Going on from the end of last video, it is short because after this i went inside GZ and BZ while getting on TS or running around between GZ and BZ while waiting on TS.

I have 5 more min recorded after this since i stopped recording because of low storage and since you would only see me lying down in different buildings.

I started later on again with recording because there was a bounty hunter in GZ that kept tazing me. (somehow he couldnt restrain me, probably because he didnt know how)

 
Since you insist on reporting this anyway in spite of 2 staff members telling you it was fine I might as well throw my hat into the ring more officially.

This isn't even remotely a player report unless you can explain how it would be "metagaming" as you put it. The darter was an example of how they can catch you without being seen. They didn't specifically claim they used it and you asked for evidence about 25 minutes after the situation took place, therefore denying them the ability to use shadowplay to get recording, then demanded recording or else you will report them.

Unless you say how this is metagaming then this is a police rule issue.

To quote the police handbook:

Searching (Rule)

You are unable to search a individual or house without their consent unless:

  • They are 1km away from a drug related area (Field, processor or dealer).
  • They have been seen with an illegal firearm by a Police Officer.
  • They have admitted to having an illegal firearm themselves.
  • You are at a Police Checkpoint.
  • If you have reasonable suspicion that they are carrying an illegal firearm.
  • You must control control a compound in which the property is in, before searching the house.
You were about 100 meters from the dealer and not present with your vehicle so they don't require your permission. Case closed as far as I can see but I might as well reiterate that they questioned the dealer and the vehicle was therefore wanted for a drugs offence. "Lack of evidence simply isn't true.

In the interest of fairness I will leave this to someone else to deal with rather than swooping in myself since you denied my answer on TS already.

 
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jaxiemaxie said:
http://plays.tv/video/5878ff2f1a106cb200/report-13-1

Going on from the end of last video, it is short because after this i went inside GZ and BZ while getting on TS or running around between GZ and BZ while waiting on TS.

I have 5 more min recorded after this since i stopped recording because of low storage and since you would only see me lying down in different buildings.

I started later on again with recording because there was a bounty hunter in GZ that kept tazing me. (somehow he couldnt restrain me, probably because he didnt know how)
Click to expand...
At this moment the trucks were only spiked as one of our precautions that we dont want them to driven of by anyone as be suspected that they were involved in a drug act. We did not search them at that time in the video that you posted.

 
Hontah said:
At this moment the trucks were only spiked as one of our precautions that we dont want them to driven of by anyone as be suspected that they were involved in a drug act. We did not search them at that time in the video that you posted.
Click to expand...
Just to elaborate on this. 

After acting on the intel we received that at least one person was running back and forth from the drug dealer, we spiked the vehicles in order to prevent them being used as a get away vehicle. 

I then proceeded to go to go and speak to the Reverend In the church, who is in actual fact an undercover informant of the police. After a short conversation with him,  he gave me the names of 2 men selling drugs. I relayed this information back to my fellow officers who then checked the registration of the truck and they matched the 2 names given to me by the clergyman. 

This, coupled with the fact they were parked around 200m from a known drug seller, gave us more than enough reason to search the vehicles. 

A thorough search was performed and a substantial amount of Processed Heroin (a highly illegal class A drug) was discovered.

We then tried to corale all of the civilians in the area to try and establish who the owner of the trucks were if the were even still in the area. At that point, no one confessed ownership of the vehicles and therefore a check was performed to make sure they weren't stolen and they were then towed away by the tow company to be made into new sport hatchbacks for RTU.

 
That is all i have recorded.

I first went on TS to talk to a staff member, making sure there is a chance i can get compensation, since for me this is alot of money.
After i talked to the staff member, i made sure i got the right officer and sended him a message on TS. This was not after 25min.
That it took 25min in total to get in a room and talk it out, sure.
Even if i had sended him a message after 5min, he still didnt record it since it has already passed.

There is not much you can do without evidence, i understand that. That is why i record almost everything. (doing runs or when rping with someone, except when useless walking around or just waiting).

You got 24 hours to report someone, nothing i can do about it if they got nothing after 25min. I even keep my recordings for around a week. (enough if anyone reports me and short enough that i got enough storage to keep recording)

All i asked if they got proof they used the drone (since they told me, that is how they knew) at that moment, seeing our trucks their with still our wheels.
Just a screenshot would have been fine with me, showing they could have seen me running to and from the drug dealer.
Since all they gave me was an picture of the drone itself and screenshot of us being wanted of drugtrafficking. (that we got after they had our trucks)

I wasnt long gone from my truck when they spiked it, perhaps i even went to the hospital to get health back to 100%, or i was rping with someone else parking their for a min or 2.

Lately on the servers, the only way to get money is doing runs with a big group (5-6 atleast). If you do something illegal you get arrested or robbed. If you do something legal you get robbed.

For me this is alot of money, that is why all i ask is for compensation. 

Since they couldnt give me any evidence that they actually used the drone, i told them im just gonna do a report and compensation request and we will see then what will happen.

1km away from a drug related area is a big area. So you can see this as 1 big drug related area.
And in the police handbook about drug related area it says:

Drug Related Areas (Rule)

If you are heading to a drug related area with the sole intention of “CAMPING” then you are to stay for no longer than 15 minutes, you are not to return to that area to camp for another 30 minutes, if you are going there to deal with a situation and you are there for more than 10 minutes this is not classed as “CAMPING” and you are permitted to return whenever you wish. If you have “CAMPED” a drug related area and your 15 minutes is up, this does not mean you can not return there to deal with a situation.

If you wanna keep 100% to the rules, this means cops arent even allowed to stay in kavala for more then 15min unles dealing with a situation, since kavala is about 1km big.(i believe a little bigger)




 
jaxiemaxie said:
All i asked if they got proof they used the drone (since they told me, that is how they knew) at that moment, seeing our trucks their with still our wheels.

Since they couldnt give me any evidence that they actually used the drone, i told them im just gonna do a report and compensation request and we will see then what will happen.
Click to expand...
Nobody in the channel said we used a darter. You said and I quote "There was no way that you could of seen us" Myself, Hontah & Connor explained that there were many ways. Such as Darter, Rangefinders and just looking at the drug dealer.

 
First of, we never said we used the darter, we used it as an example of the surveillance tools the police have at their disposal. 

Just because you don't see someone watching you, doesn't mean they aren't there - that's the whole point of surveillance. Yet you are adamant we provide evidence that we spotted you st the drug dealer (which has already been mentioned we can't acquire). 

I know 1Km is a big area and would be quite far away from the drug dealer, hence why we checked with the dealer for the names first. And you were only around 200m so with distances like that it's common sense. 

If it had had been a mistake and you had in fact, been st the hospital and it was another person witnessed walking going backwards and forth, we would have sincerely apologised and repaired your vehicle, allowing you to drive off hassle free. But that was not the case. 

 
I won't record every situation I deal with. Simple as if I see someone with a weapon then storing it in his car. I won't record the situation just because he might ask for evidence on why he got searched and call me into liaison, no that's not how it works. If it this way then we should have shadowplay running 24/7 just because some random guy thinks we are breaking server rules. You claim we are metagaming, so you should have the evidence where it is clearly shown that we are metagaming and not ask us for evidence. That's how it works, if you claim something then you better have some valid proof of your assumptions. I find this situation very ridiculous

 
Looking at this an opinions from other staff, it does not look like a metagaming incident as police have tactics like this find drug traffickers, and from the looks of it they would not have really been able to interacting with you as you avoiding all human contact. I see no metagaming involved in this from what i can see - denied

Also regarding some comments about being no pint messaging after 5 mins of incident, programs like shadowplay can record back as 20 mins if they want so it would not have been too late.
 
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