Report a Player - CSI Creebles - RDM

[MrLongSlong]

Your In-game name

MrLongSlong

Name of the player(s) you are reporting

CSI Creebles

Date of the incident

02/20/20

Time of the incident (GMT)

2030

What best describes this incident ?

RDM

Which server did the incident take place on

Altis Life

Please (in detail) describe the incident

We where heading to Kalevala from airport, I crashed in agios, we assumed there was a gunfight going on as we heard shots, I got away from my van because it was going to blow, and then put my MK20 in my backpack because of the gunfight, I get shot, he said it was because I had a PM, but the shots started landing before then, if you make a mistake and shoot the wrong person in a gunfight thats understandable , but refusing to take responsibility for it or even compensate the person is unacceptable and shows a clear disregard for the rules by abusing this loophole to turn anywhere where there a gunfight into a redzone.

Link to any evidence (Youtube/Screenshot)

https://youtu.be/Wz8M_9aw43w
This report is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth!

Yes

You tried to resolve the situation with the player(s) before reporting

Yes

This is not a revenge report (Abuse will lead to forum/community bans)

Yes

 

[CSI Creebles]

I think this report is fairly petty considering you're very well aware that hobo-looking players with hidden guns going behind cops to kill them are a thing on the server.
But let's focus on the facts: You knew you were getting into a gunfight when you approached the town as it was stated "ohh gunfight" after clearly hearing Mk1 shots. You then proceeded to run out, with a visible rifle and pistol during said active gunfight on that side of the town and you were deemed a threat for the Police officers sitting nearby.

Now, to address the fact that I didn't want to take responsibility nor compensate, I had a consultation with an admin (which I made you aware of, but you ignored it and closed the chat) and it was in fact suggested that, due to the circumstances, I should not grant you compensation.

Also, I believe that a 3 minute video is still required for RDM cases (?)

Not gonna beat the bush around more than we have to, so I'll only answer questions made by the staff team from this point.

 

[MrLongSlong]

 You knew you were getting into a gunfight when you approached the town as it was stated "ohh gunfight" after clearly hearing Mk1 shots. You then proceeded to run out, with a visible rifle and pistol during said active gunfight on that side of the town and you were deemed a threat for the Police officers sitting nearby.

We where only aware of the gunfight as we came into Agios, as you can see in the video I crashed and my van was going to blow up (it blows up later on) so I ran away from it and after getting a safe distance away from the van i put my gun away.

Now, to address the fact that I didn't want to take responsibility nor compensate, I had a consultation with an admin (which I made you aware of, but you ignored it and closed the chat) and it was in fact suggested that, due to the circumstances, I should not grant you compensation.

I understand that, but its part of a wider problem of when gunfights start its automatically a redzone, its not, if you kill the wrong person, you compensate them for that, you don't just assume there intentions.

Also, I believe that a 3 minute video is still required for RDM cases (?)

I have provided that clip, we can both agree mutually that there was no interaction between us before the situation occurred can we not, saying that we need a longer video isn't necessary now is it.

I think this report is fairly petty considering you're very well aware that hobo-looking players with hidden guns going behind cops to kill them are a thing on the server.

Not too sure what you mean here, maybe elaborate?

It would also be nice to see where you were shooting from in this gunfight you where having as I'm sure you would be able to see me jumping out of the van after crashing.

 I had a consultation with an admin

Which admin? did you show them a video? 

Not gonna beat the bush around more than we have to, so I'll only answer questions made by the staff team from this point.

I see no reason as to why you can't answer a few questions, as after all it was a mistake on your part surely? If I had just killed an innocent person in a gunfight and then they approached me afterwards proving that they weren't involved and that it was a mistake I would have gladly compensated them for there losses? is that truly great character for a CSI within the police force? go around killing everyone and anyone in a gunfight without a thought behind any sort of target identification.

 

[KingGodDiabloZ]

In order for me to properly judge the situation, a at least 3 minute video will need to be shown. Otherwise I am unable to properly judge the situation and determine whether there was no relevant previous interaction. 

@MrLongSlong

 

[MrLongSlong]

In order for me to properly judge the situation, a at least 3 minute video will need to be shown. Otherwise I am unable to properly judge the situation and determine whether there was no relevant previous interaction. 

@MrLongSlong

I'm sure @CSI Creebles can certify himself that there was no previous interaction between us, as I do not have a longer video.

Also no offence I'm by no way accusing you of any malaise but I find it a bit odd that you chose to deal with a player report that concerns a good friend of yours baring in mind you haven't dealt with a player report since January 10th+ seems weird to me that you start with one thats reporting your friend.

Now I could be chattin absolute dribble and there might be some other reason as to why you would start with this one etc  but to me it doesn't seem best practice to deal with players reports that are targeted at your friends.

I think its only fair that a staff member that doesn't have affiliation with either side deal with the report that way they can be sure they make a "proper judgement".

https://gyazo.com/894dd9838bbe94c29ad912866af6bfa1

https://gyazo.com/f9aa6e6d23bbe74a82cfdce25f6e812c

 

[KingGodDiabloZ]

I'm sure @CSI Creebles can certify himself that there was no previous interaction between us, as I do not have a longer video.

Also no offence I'm by no way accusing you of any malaise but I find it a bit odd that you chose to deal with a player report that concerns a good friend of yours baring in mind you haven't dealt with a player report since January 10th+ seems weird to me that you start with one thats reporting your friend.

Now I could be chattin absolute dribble and there might be some other reason as to why you would start with this one etc  but to me it doesn't seem best practice to deal with players reports that are targeted at your friends.

I think its only fair that a staff member that doesn't have affiliation with either side deal with the report that way they can be sure they make a "proper judgement".

https://gyazo.com/894dd9838bbe94c29ad912866af6bfa1

https://gyazo.com/f9aa6e6d23bbe74a82cfdce25f6e812c

If I were to not deal with player reports of people I'd know in some way/have played with then I wouldn't be able to deal with a single case. As I've been here for nearing 4 years so I do know a lot of people. As of why I began with this report is simply is that I look over reports every now and then and if I notice an inconsistency which can be fixed (no evidence, lacking evidence etc.) instead of making the people wait I reply on it myself . But indeed the reports that need to be reviewed and have no inconsistencies like lacking evidence etc. are most often left to level 3 staff members. 

Also, if you feel after the outcome of the report that the wrong decision has been made in any sort of way or that you feel the outcome was biased then by all means feel free to fill in a complaint by sending 1 PM to all 4 staff leads with your complaint clearly written down. 

You stated that @CSI Creebles will verify it so I'll leave that up to him. If Creebles states that he feels this video is sufficient to judge this scene then he can state so and we will proceed purely based on this evidence. But if he feels that it is not then we will handle per our guidelines (3 minute video required for an RDM report). So I'll leave it up to @CSI Creebles to decide

 

[MrLongSlong]

If I were to not deal with player reports of people I'd know in some way/have played with then I wouldn't be able to deal with a single case.

Its not really a brief acquaintance with him is it though? you literally have his name in your staff room channel , you say you have met loads of people in your 4 years here but why aren't there 4 years worth of names in there? its a little bit more then how your describing, I don't mean to keep going back to this but its to me at least a massive conflict of interest for you.

 

[KingGodDiabloZ]

I’m not going to further discuss this and stand by my previous post. So unless there is anything relevant to add to the report please refrain from posting on it. 

 

[CSI Creebles]

 ​

You stated that @CSI Creebles will verify it so I'll leave that up to him. If Creebles states that he feels this video is sufficient to judge this scene then he can state so and we will proceed purely based on this evidence. But if he feels that it is not then we will handle per our guidelines (3 minute video required for an RDM report). So I'll leave it up to @CSI Creebles to decide

Considering the kind of situation and the fact that during a gunfight I do not necessarily go around getting player nametags, I would feel more more comfortable with a longer video. And like I mentioned in my initial response, I still am of the idea that a person with a firearm out within the area of an ongoing gunfight is to be demeed a threat to the nearby officers and hence why I discharged my weapon. 

 

[KingGodDiabloZ]

I believe, judging by your answer, that my question was perceived wrongly and looking back at my message this was most likely caused by the way I articulated the question. So I apologize for that. The question I meant to ask was very bluntly said: "was there any interaction between you and mrlongslong prior to the shooting?". 

@CSI Creebles

 

[KingGodDiabloZ]

@CSI Creebles ^?

 

[CSI Creebles]

Apologies for not responding earlier @KingGodDiabloZ, I am running on a fairly tight schedule. 

I'm sure you know that, as it usually happens in most gunfights, specialist units like NCA (in this case) are often called in after the gunfight has started and so player to player interaction can be very limited. Since I was not the "initiating officer" and instead came in aid to another unit in distress, I did not have voice interaction with any of the other rebels I shot. Despite that, I did not have to question their involvement in the situation as I do believe that every rebel with a firearm out in the middle of an active firefight is to be considered a threat.

 

[MrLongSlong]

Apologies for not responding earlier @KingGodDiabloZ, I am running on a fairly tight schedule. 

I'm sure you know that, as it usually happens in most gunfights, specialist units like NCA (in this case) are often called in after the gunfight has started and so player to player interaction can be very limited. Since I was not the "initiating officer" and instead came in aid to another unit in distress, I did not have voice interaction with any of the other rebels I shot. Despite that, I did not have to question their involvement in the situation as I do believe that every rebel with a firearm out in the middle of an active firefight is to be considered a threat.

Simple question mate , I know we didn’t have any interaction should be easy answer for you aswell.

 

[KingGodDiabloZ]

Thank you for responding @CSI Creebles. To make it easier to refer back to am going to interpret your answer as a "No". As for the formal question that was asked initially of: "will this video be sufficient to judge the situation, or will the evidence be insufficient and will the case be dismissed on that ground?". I'm going to accept the video and thus will judge the situation as if there was no previous interaction between the two parties and the length of the video will not be taken into account. However, @MrLongSlong please ensure that in the future on all reports regarding RDM you post a video that is at least 2/3 minutes previous to the situation happening.  

In this particular situation a claim of RDM is made. Previous reports have shown that the question in this situation is if @CSI Creebles had the right to see @MrLongSlong as involved in the situation and thus did he have the right to shoot him. This often comes to question and especially in a situation involving rebels, as it's not always easy to determine who is involved and who isn't. 

As a sidenote before we move onto the report. This situation has been discussed with others, this message is however typed solely by myself. 

[SIZE=11pt]In the video it is seen that @MrLongSlong is driving with a speed of approximately 150 km/h into the town of Agios. @MrLongSlong[/SIZE] and the person that you are talking with over teamspeak/discord both acknowledge that there is a gunfight going on (0:18-0:20). Longslong then crash into two vehicles that are in the middle of the road and then jumps out of the vehicle and starts running. This is the moment that he stops to run and places his main firearm in his backpack. At the same time a police vehicle filled with rebels approaches and begins to decamp. When putting away your main firearm the animation of your pistol being drawn is automatically performed due to the way the in-game mechanics work. This is the moment that you were shot at and killed by Creebles. While you are being shot you start healing and scream that you are friendly.

[SIZE=11pt]There are a few things that I am taking into consideration here coming to my conclusion. First of all Slong's speed. He was driving 150km/h into a residential area, which is way above the speed limit (alarm bell 1 for a police officer). You acknowledge there is a gunfight and any other people in the area would know considering the loud sound of gunshots, you still however decide to come speeding through the zone with an insane speed instead of turning around and going away (alarm bell 2 for a police officer). You are then seem crashing into a vehicle and decamping the vehicle with a high powered rifle on your back (alarm bell 3 for a police officer). Other people with firearms then decamp next to you in a police vehicle (alarm bell 4 for a police officer). You then pull out a pistol (due to the animation) (alarm bell 5 for a police officer). These are the 5 alarm bells that I can figure from this video. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=14.6667px]Based on the 5 alarm bells that I found and the very short timespan this situation took place in (less then 30/40 seconds). I am going to justify the shooting by @CSI Creebles and decline the report. I feel that Creebles had enough "alarm bells" going off to reasonably suspect you of being involved in the gunfight. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=14.6667px]However, there are a few things that I like to note. I do believe that this could have all been resolved by a simple conversation between the two of you. @MrLongSlong I disagree with the statement you are attempting to make of that if you shoot someone that is not involved in a gunfight that you always need to compensate this person. However I do think that if it happens and the person is unreasonably negatively affected by it, that the person that accidentally shot the person should indeed issue some kind of compensation. Even if they aren't forced to do so. So @CSI Creebles I do advise you in the future to deal with this situation a lot better, compensate if the person is unreasonably negatively affected but at least apologize if it happens. I'm inviting Creebles to at least go and apologize to Slong for the shooting of Slong (even though it was justified) and I recommend you to talk it out if there are any "hard feelings" towards each other.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=14.6667px]So to sum it up, I'm going to be declining this report as the shooting was justified. If there are any questions, please feel free to come forward to myself. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=14.6667px]Declined[/SIZE]

 

[KingGodDiabloZ]

Thank you for your report, Unfortunately, it has been declined

The staff member will advise shortly why on this occasion they have declined to take action against the reported player.

Please do not let this put you off making further reports in the future, We rely on our player base to help keep our community clean.