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Critique about some police who scrap vehicles

tristanboy15

Banned
Location
The Netherlands
Hello,

Let's start off in a happy mood, because I can almost say that I've been a member of this server for 2 years. But, there is always that little thing that bothers you, and what bothers me? Some police officers.

I joined the police a long time ago and I can proudly say that I've been in the force for 9 weeks and I wasn't expecting to leave, but I did. I mainly left because of some people, ruining my experience. After that I noticed the roleplay of some officers. I'm not ashamed for saying this, but it made me quit the server. If you only do one thing, you're wanted. And when you're wanted, expect the police to ANPR you once and get ready to roleplay with them or get chased.

Now, months later, I returned to play some more ArmA. 

Even though I may not like the police, I'm trying to roleplay with them again. I am not going to mention names but this scenario happened to me:

Someone died at the Kavala Square and I brought him to the hospital with my stretcher and gokart. I need to be honest, driving a gokart into the hospital isn't a smart idea. A few minutes later police came, because the CSI died and they brought him over to the bed. Knowing me, I tried to leave the hospital by driving my gokart through a doorway, but instead it got stuck. One of the officers walked over to me and asked if this was my gokart and I responded, while I was walking off, by saying yes. (In the meanwhile he started scrapping my gokart without saying anything, or even attempting to roleplay). After that he casually walked off and I never heard anything of him again.

I contacted him on teamspeak, but I won't say anything about it.

This literally always happens to me, and yes, he's a part of AR but that doesn't matter about the fact he needs to roleplay. 

Besides that, I've also had good experience with some officers but I felt like saying this was necessarily because this bothers me a lot when roleplaying with some officers.

-Tristan.

 
I expect hate coming my way but I personally disagree with the ANPR system along with the wanted system.

The reason for this is I really am not looking for trouble with the police however, regardless of what I do if a cop car ANPR's you and you're wanted they will pull you over. 9/10 I will have a gun and regardless if I put it in my car or not they will still search the car because you're wanted. I understand it's your job to stop crimes but honestly, how on earth do you know it's me that's killed x amount of people/robbed some guy when there is no possible way as I have never identified who I am. It's blatant powergaming and honestly I expect better from a roleplay server as i'd love to hear the reason how the cops figure out you've done all these crimes.

Like honestly,  it's just one big metagame that whole system. even if you wear a shamag you still get wanted for killing someone even though there is no possible way they know who you are but yet you acquire a warrant under your name.

 
9/10 when we pull a wanted vehicle over, the driver says 'it's my friends vehicle' because they know they're wanted.

to be fair, it comes with the territory, can't do the time, don't do the crime ;)

 
Anyways if officer wants to scrap a vehicle knowing there's owner around they should put little effort on role play. End of the day if you are unhappy of someones action as police and you think everything was not right at that point you can bring it to PCC and if he did something wrong it will be dealt with.

 
@GHOSTK1LL3R

Well... if you think about it.

You kill someone > Drive away with a vehicle > the camera that saw you sees the number plate >  It sends a signal to the police > police does classified  research > They go to the motorshop or clothing shop they ask anyone < you're now wanted. 

 
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I expect hate coming my way but I personally disagree with the ANPR system along with the wanted system.

The reason for this is I really am not looking for trouble with the police however, regardless of what I do if a cop car ANPR's you and you're wanted they will pull you over. 9/10 I will have a gun and regardless if I put it in my car or not they will still search the car because you're wanted. I understand it's your job to stop crimes but honestly, how on earth do you know it's me that's killed x amount of people/robbed some guy when there is no possible way as I have never identified who I am. It's blatant powergaming and honestly I expect better from a roleplay server as i'd love to hear the reason how the cops figure out you've done all these crimes.

Like honestly,  it's just one big metagame that whole system. even if you wear a shamag you still get wanted for killing someone even though there is no possible way they know who you are but yet you acquire a warrant under your name.
How on earth are we then supposed to figure out who is wanted and who's done crime if we can't even use the ANPR and wanted list? You call it powergaming, how is it powergaming might I ask? Also if you're not looking for truoble the DON'T DO CRIME AND DON'T GO AROUND WITH ILLEGAL FIREARMS otherwise you can't say you're not looking for trouble...

 
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I need to be honest, driving a gokart into the hospital isn't a smart idea. A few minutes later police came, because the CSI died and they brought him over to the bed. Knowing me, I tried to leave the hospital by driving my gokart through a doorway, but instead it got stuck. One of the officers walked over to me and asked if this was my gokart and I responded, while I was walking off, by saying yes. (In the meanwhile he started scrapping my gokart without saying anything, or even attempting to roleplay). After that he casually walked off and I never heard anything of him again.
A go-kart used on public roads is scrapable on sight so there was no policy break there but to do this without any form of RP is not acceptable.

If you fail to get a resolution in TS with the officer, then this is what the Police Complaints Commission is for. 

The reason for this is I really am not looking for trouble with the police however, regardless of what I do if a cop car ANPR's you and you're wanted they will pull you over. 9/10 I will have a gun and regardless if I put it in my car or not they will still search the car because you're wanted.
When I read this, to me it suggests you would like to be able to make money doing illegal things, or be involved in gunfights without the possibility of getting caught.

You as the player have the choice to make money this way, or by engaging in firefights. By doing so, you're entering into the spirit of RP and accepting that you will most likely be pulled over by the police. You also make the decision to carry an illegal weapon with you, and by your own admission, you accept you have a high chance of being pulled over and that weapon taken off you due to your wanted status.  Essentially you make the choice and accept the possible consequences. It's not like there are no alternatives to this. You also make the choice to carry an illegal weapon knowing you are wanted.

I play as civ frequently. I make money legally, I carry an SMG (illegal) yet it has never been taken from me because I avoid run ins with the law due to not getting a warrant for my arrest. Many other players chose the legal path for this reason.  If I do have to use my SMG in self defense and get a warrant, I send a message through the police dispatch, drop my weapon in my house, then hand myself into the police with my version of events, having go-pro footage on hand should it be needed.

If I happen to get pulled over enroute due to my wanted status, then I RP with the cops and try to explain. Again, I have the dispatch call on record and the go-pro footage available.  If they remove my illegal weapon, then so be it. It's illegal and I knew the risk when I bought it. I don't get salty.

The thing some people don't get, is that  the wanted system and the police are there for roleplay reasons. To let people play criminal in a realistic way with all the risks that come with being a criminal. It's the police's job to catch you, and it's your job to not get caught. When you do get caught, roleplay.

At the end of the day, playing criminal is player choice.
 

 
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I think I understand your point however, go-kart in a hospital? Like really? What do you expect?

However this is my current predicament I face everyday and I don't think you or many people for that fact see this:

So on one hand, we have the "its only a game" approach, in this approach it dictates that fun should be allowed, so driving into the hospital in a go-kart would be completely fine and would more than likely result in others joining in. The primary problem with this approach is when the police start to have fun and ease off on the professionalism, I then get flooded with complaints. Not to mention this also looks completely unprofessional to new players. This approach is how I see you would take things.

On the other hand, we have the "Serious and Professional" approach. This isn't the polar opposite but in cases such as driving into hospital buildings will get you arrested and charged. When complaints arise, they are always dealt with under this approach. This is what I personally believe is more fun in the long run for everyone on the server. If we did not continue to push more serious roleplay, complaints would go up and everyone's general experience would go down. Under this point, we have the ANPR discussion that is going on, ANPR is an essential part of what we do, likewise to the real police, as for thew way it works in-game, it has completely changed from they way you would remember doing it as a police officer and for anyone who hasn't yet tried it as police I don't feel it fair for you to comment on what you think is the right system until you have tried the new way which is much harder.

Right, "I mainly left because of some people, ruining my experience."

I would agree, the attitude of some does ruin it for others, but if you don't communicate this towards us, we cannot do anything. This is the first I have heard of it therefore the first opportunity I can start to implement procedures to rectify anything that is being done wrong or ruining roleplay in this case. In future if you bring general issues forward to a member of police command (SI+), we can begin to fix them. 

As for the example you provided, I don't believe I'm the CSI you mentioned in the post however, if I was you, continue to try and speak to the officer and if it was exactly how you say it was then there is something wrong with the roleplay there.

Please note: I'am not intending to counter any of your points, and I'm not saying that your wrong, I'm just trying to give you a little insight as to what we as police command have to weigh up when making decisions.

 
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@ I do still know the person who scrapped the GoKart on sight. I asked him on teamspeak why he did it and the only response I got was: You were walking off and you didn't respond. So, that  must be strange. I was standing 2 feet next to him before walking off by saying: Yes, this is my GoKart. Out of experience, no matter what your rank is inside the police, your friends will always carry you. And even if I had it recorded, I'm sure nothing would've happened either. I'm just frustrated because I'm always the target, from which I'm experiencing. I have made complaints in the past, but they were just being defended.

 
When I read this, to me it suggests you would like to be able to make money doing illegal things, or be involved in gunfights without the possibility of getting caught.
No? I am stating this is a roleplay server so explain to me how this warrant system powergaming who-ever is doing the crime is realistic?

You as the player have the choice to make money this way, or by engaging in firefights. By doing so, you're entering into the spirit of RP and accepting that you will most likely be pulled over by the police.
I am not denying that, however as I stated there is zero roleplay of the cops figuring out I robbed a house it's just power powergame that this system knows I am robbing said house.

You also make the decision to carry an illegal weapon with you, and by your own admission, you accept you have a high chance of being pulled over and that weapon taken off you due to your wanted status.  Essentially you make the choice and accept the possible consequences. It's not like there are no alternatives to this. You also make the choice to carry an illegal weapon knowing you are wanted.
I completely agree, however it's not detective work that I am getting caught robbing houses it's pure powergaming that you know that it was me that robbed the house. There would be zero roleplay that you stopped me put me in handcuffs and interrogated me to find out that I robbed that house. It's as soon as I would to rob a house you know for a fact I did it (I am choosing this as an example and stating the system currently in place is powergaming).

I play as civ frequently. I make money legally, I carry an SMG (illegal) yet it has never been taken from me because I avoid run ins with the law due to not getting a warrant for my arrest. Many other players chose the legal path for this reason.  If I do have to use my SMG in self defense and get a warrant, I send a message through the police dispatch, drop my weapon in my house, then hand myself into the police with my version of events, having go-pro footage on hand should it be needed.
That is your form of roleplay and your choice of how you do it and you're missing the point of my statement. The system currently in place is pure powergaming and there is no way the cops would know you killed x amount of people.

If I happen to get pulled over enroute due to my wanted status, then I RP with the cops and try to explain. Again, I have the dispatch call on record and the go-pro footage available.  If they remove my illegal weapon, then so be it. It's illegal and I knew the risk when I bought it. I don't get salty.

The thing some people don't get, is that  the wanted system and the police are there for roleplay reasons. To let people play criminal in a realistic way with all the risks that come with being a criminal. It's the police's job to catch you, and it's your job to not get caught. When you do get caught, roleplay.

At the end of the day, playing criminal is player choice.
 
Missing the whole point of my statement.

@GHOSTK1LL3R

Well... if you think about it.

You kill someone > Drive away with a vehicle > the camera that saw you sees the number plate >  It sends a signal to the police > police does classified  research > They go to the motorshop or clothing shop they ask anyone < you're now wanted. 
I understand that you're trying to relate to roleplay, however I am normally nowhere near my car when I kill someone or even in someone elses car. So why am I still the one getting warranted for it? Regardless of what you're going to state, it's straight up powergaming that you somehow know it's me who committed the crime. I mean if there was a feature in place when you've got a shemag you don't get warranted fair enough. However, there isn't even a feature like that.

How on earth are we then supposed to figure out who is wanted and who's done crime if we can't even use the ANPR and wanted list?
Through actual roleplay? You say it yourself (cops generalised) you want us to roleplay with you. However, when it comes to you having to roleplay to find out who did the crime then you'd prefer to just let the 24/7 surveillance which has face recognition to figure it out... With regard to the ANPR, I think it'sfine owever I disagree that we get warranted for everything wrong we do regardless of where it is or what we're wearing.

You call it powergaming, how is it powergaming might I ask? Also if you're not looking for truoble the DON'T DO CRIME AND DON'T GO AROUND WITH ILLEGAL FIREARMS otherwise you can't say you're not looking for trouble...
How isn't it powergaming. Explain this then to me matey. I have a shemag on and I walk up to a house and start robbing it. How do you know that it's GHOSTK1LL3R robbing that house then? You can't, its powergaming.

INS LONG BEARD said:
I do understand your point of view. You're saying that because no one saw you break into the house you shouldn't be added to the wanted list. It's a fair point and yes, it's unrealistic since no one actually witnessed you and even CCTV wouldn't work because you're wearing a shemag, I get it.
Indeed

Shemags aside, given that this is supposed to be 2030 something (I can't remember the exact date), you could assume that crime detection is far more advanced now than in the past. Maybe autonomous drones constantly patrolling the skies registering crimes as they happen. CCTV systems that have xray - infrared technologies that penetrate face-masks. Who knows, the possibilities are mind boggling. It is the future after all. 
You could equally assume that rebels would have chips which make them undetectable from CCTV's recognising them and their facial recognition :).

It is a game at the end of the day, and without that system, cops would have nothing to do but respond to HM treasury or gas station robberies which happen infrequently.
I disagree, I would love to see cops responding to actual houses getting robbed rather than only doing it if they can be bothered. If the system was implemented then it would literally increase to more RP because of not then cops wouldn't be able to arrest people.

This would make being a cop exceptionally one dimensional and boring and no one would want to be a cop, which in turn would drastically decrease the amount of roleplay opportunities for everyone including civs making Altis life a rather dull life.  You only have to look at the NHS. Often there are no medics online, or only one or two. (sorry NHS). I think this comes down to the fact there isn't a lot to do playing medic and it gets repetitive. 
It honestly wouldn't, currently it is you ANPR someone and if they're warranted they get pulled over. If this system was to get changed you'd then see cops actually actively making sting operations (Pretending to buy guns, doing drug runs with others to get them caught doing drugs etc) rather than 'that guy is warranted, god knows how we got the information on it but lets arrest him regardless.

I am not stating by the way that no roleplay occurs once you get ANPR'd but with this powergame system being removed it would lead to police actually having to roleplay to figure out who/what did the crime.

I would also argue that without this mechanic, playing criminal without any risks would also become very dull and boring. Money would be very easy to make and people would just get bored and drift of to something else. At least this way it's a challenge and exciting and opens up many RP opportunities. 
Money wouldn't be easy to make honestly, you could still pull people over who are driving around a drug related area, you could perform checkpoints where high population drive around and anyone that  skips it gets spikes.

It's honestly how far you as the police are willing to actually roleplay. Right now you're getting spoon-fed this knowledge you get from the gods and we just have to bow to this systems bidding. With you not getting spoon-fed this information it would force you to actually catch people out rather than just somehow knowing every single crime someone commits.

 
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Through actual roleplay? You say it yourself (cops generalised) you want us to roleplay with you. However, when it comes to you having to roleplay to find out who did the crime then you'd prefer to just let the 24/7 surveillance which has face recognition to figure it out... With regard to the ANPR, I think it'sfine owever I disagree that we get warranted for everything wrong we do regardless of where it is or what we're wearing.
I'm sorry but how in hell are we supposed to do this? You honestly think we should roleplay who did what crime? It would be bloody impossible...

"So what's you're name?"

"Bob"

"So, Bob, is this you're HEMMT filled with weed?"

"No"

"Then why are you here?"

"Why not, CAN YOU PROVE I'VE DONE ANYTHING WRONG?"

Like honestly this would make getting evidence impossible... I'm not saying the system is flawless but it is an essential part of all police work. We have a hard time as it is, why make it harder?

 
No? I am stating this is a roleplay server so explain to me how this warrant system powergaming who-ever is doing the crime is realistic?
I do understand your point of view. You're saying that because no one saw you break into the house you shouldn't be added to the wanted list. It's a fair point and yes, it's unrealistic since no one actually witnessed you and even CCTV wouldn't work because you're wearing a shemag, I get it.

Shemags aside, given that this is supposed to be 2030 something (I can't remember the exact date), you could assume that crime detection is far more advanced now than in the past. Maybe autonomous drones constantly patrolling the skies registering crimes as they happen. CCTV systems that have xray - infrared technologies that penetrate face-masks. Who knows, the possibilities are mind boggling. It is the future after all. 

It is a game at the end of the day, and without that system, cops would have nothing to do but respond to HM treasury or gas station robberies which happen infrequently. This would make being a cop exceptionally one dimensional and boring and no one would want to be a cop, which in turn would drastically decrease the amount of roleplay opportunities for everyone including civs making Altis life a rather dull life.  You only have to look at the NHS. Often there are no medics online, or only one or two. (sorry NHS). I think this comes down to the fact there isn't a lot to do playing medic and it gets repetitive. 

I would also argue that without this mechanic, playing criminal without any risks would also become very dull and boring. Money would be very easy to make and people would just get bored and drift of to something else. At least this way it's a challenge and exciting and opens up many RP opportunities. 

 
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