Just A Few Suggestions

[crazycattxo]

Hey everyone! I posted a suggestion a while back, and after taking a short break, I’m back and wanted to share some of my thoughts again, plus a few new suggestions. I’ve definitely noticed some changes around the City, but honestly, not all of them have been for the better. The development updates have been awesome, no doubt, but there’s still this sense that things feel kind of divided when it comes to who gets what. Some groups or businesses seem to have more advantages than others. It’s also a little frustrating seeing so many people wanting to buy businesses around the city to bring more RP into the mix, especially buildings which aren't really opened or say a new business but getting told it’s not really an option. It feels like only one or two businesses get all the attention, while others don’t get the same opportunities or focus. And this extends to groups too. I know some might disagree, but everyone’s entitled to their opinion, right? I just wish the average person had more chances, and it wasn’t always the popular groups, individuals, or businesses that get the best of everything.

Here's some suggestions I'd love to see, to maybe try and stop this feeling of a divide.

More support for the average civilians
I feel there definitely needs to be more civ jobs, there's a total of about 4 jobs you can do. Perhaps a building job, or some interactive heists a few friends can do to pass the time. Of course with a cooldown. More support for character driven jobs, it's a roleplay server that relies on peer to peer interactions yet when people create peer to peer interactive jobs they get pushed back. I'm not talking about like "jobs" like bins, mechanic, delivery drivers I'm thinking more like support for opening businesses. It feels like we all get told no, because the highlight wants to be kept on certain current businesses. I wish we could all be given the same opportunities.

Gangs
In my opinion groups/gangs/factions shouldn't be able to own more than 1 business per gang to give others a chance. {Yes, of course if they've been around a very long time it may be a bit different, as long as it is fair which at the moment in some cases it doesnt feel so } I also feel and I'm only using this as an example, every gang, group, faction, family should be limited to the same amount of things. Including compounds etc. I'm completely aware of the reasoning behind the Firm and the Lost, but it does feel like it's very favourited in some aspects and a lot of other groups, whether upcoming or currently around don't get as many opportunities. Theres a huge gap between whitelisted gangs/businesses then when people try to push to close that gap it gets denied. There's plenty of opportunities to open "roleplay" jobs with very little input from areas. This is things such as simple jobs like road repairs, dock work transportation, construction work but we are given no support to do these things. You either join the server to become police/nhs or gang. There's no support for people who just want to roleplay their own work. Or if there is we have to really prove, whereas if certain numbers want something it's put in without much hesitation.

I'm worried the City is just one that is very favourite orientated. It's upsetting because so many people have so many amazing ideas, and avenues they wish to explore in RP, but again. If they're not part of a well known business or group, or just individual in general it feels its never wanted or always denied. I just wish we could see more inclusivity, thats all.

 

[Astrid Belski]

Apologies that in the last 2 years the only thing we added was bin jobs and picking lettuces. I think you are missing on some stuff.

Apologies, I can only comment on what I've seen and found in RP, to be fair I did find potatoes, tomatoes and something else to pick.

 

[MartinShipman11]

Lets talk about more stuff for civs to do. Why not coming up with a new recipe instead of copy cat what others have done?
(no pointing fingers at anyone here but think about this)
- Why would we need a third mechanic shop?
- Why would we need more restaurants? ( we currently have 16)
It is not only the dev work needed for it, it is also the longevity. How long would a third mehanic shop last? or a 17th restaurant?
If we give a third mechanic shop, why not a fourth? 5th? where do we draw the line?

I would just like to argue this point by saying why do we need a 42nd gang? Gangs come and go all the time, just today we saw 3 pack up shop for whatever reasons, it wont be long before another 3 start up right?

We have empty MLOS, go there create new ideas. - I know it is hard, this is the hardest part in roleplay.

I agree with you, its very easy for fresh people to the city to have a look around and be introduced to the main handful of "civie jobs" and go from there, but if I came to higher ups and said, okay I have a great idea for something I haven't seen yet but it requires admin/dev help with setting up, I'd get told to eat my own ass wouldn't I?

Yes they could, people can also use taxis, people from restaurants can also use bin jobs and ask for their bin to be removed, we could even force restaurants to use food delivery job. The sad reality is, this only last so long till it gets outdated with the most money/hour job.

These would be fantastic ideas to implement. The supply chain already goes from growing, harvesting, preparing to serving. Why not be able to extend that? The answer to your issue lies within your response money/hour jobs outweigh roleplay opportunity job? Highlighting a previous point I made where the economy is currently doodoo.

 

[Teej McGee]

It will probably be denied, and so I've waisted all that time pushing for it. Because I enjoy it and want to see something come from it.

Then why not continue with it anyways, if you're enjoying it? How long have you been doing it for?

Also, who knows through future roleplay scenarios and interactions that 'something' or an 'opportunity' is offered to you?

It is not only the dev work needed for it, it is also the longevity. How long would a third mehanic shop last? or a 17th restaurant?
If we give a third mechanic shop, why not a fourth? 5th? where do we draw the line?

We have empty MLOS, go there create new ideas. - I know it is hard, this is the hardest part in roleplay.

There are plenty of spaces, one which you yourself have found, that are currently vacant and you are taking up shop in. This is fantastic!

Putting your characters' stamp on something takes time and dedication not just from yourself but others putting it into the City.

I imagine there also is the consideration by development and others regarding if you plan on sticking around to further the business, or if your interest would disappear after a month. Then it would be seen as potential development time lost that could've gone into something else to improve city life.

I'd say take it step by step, action your grand opening. If G6 aren't available through RP, maybe there are other ways of having security provided? Maybe if no security can be provided, there are roleplay percussions to resolve in roleplay.

 

[Bobinz]

Personally and this is just MY opinion. I noticed a little bit of inactivity from some Mechanic shops. Yes, this may be argued against and thats fine. So, I decided to open a TOWING and Repair business. Since then, I've noticed a massive increase in activity from both. Which is a plus right? I'm focusing on more on the go repairs, they focus more so on shop repairs and customisations. Personally, I saw by having another similar business, it pushed more avenues. But, from a development POV I think why? It will probably be denied, and so I've waisted all that time pushing for it. Because I enjoy it and want to see something come from it.

Why would this be denied? It may not be instant (like nothing ever was).

But are you also looking forward in doing something for fun or for profits?

I am not able to tell you exactly as he, but I do remember seing @Joe Scrub starting with his delivery jobs, from shops to vehicle parts to cars for dealerships. He did stick to his roleplay and still to this day. I remeber having him saved as "Joe Scrub towing and delivery company" - asomething along those looooong lines. Lets ask him if he expected to be rewarded when he was doing that?

If you only run for the rewards, you will not be in the run for long. Eventually that fuel will burn, what will you do then?

Do what you think its funny, what you enjoy and stick with it, it will happen. Prove to the whole community why we need your services or what you are providing.


Before the mechanic shops, there were just 1 repair kit and upgrades needed to be in LSCustoms. (I believe) Mechanic kits were added for the mechanic shops (to give them a purpose).

 

[Teej McGee]

The answer to your issue lies within your response money/hour jobs outweigh roleplay opportunity job? Highlighting a previous point I made where the economy is currently doodoo.

To me, this is a Community mindset issue and not a development issue. Roleplay should outweigh resources, although I do understand to a degree that -some- roleplay can be cost dependant.

Speaking of food/opportunities, hopefully more will be provided soon. Let's just wait and see in the City.

 

[Mrgibbs]

I've tried very hard. I've tried for days to contact G6, even track them down. Nothing. But, funny how when certain Factions do events, they have G6 there within no time at all.

At the end of the day, its never going to change. Like Astrid noted, it's been something asked about for YEARS. Incredible roleplayers leaving etc. And even there, no change will happen for the two mechanics being the only mechanics getting the main stuff.

It's like screaming and no-one hearing. It's not even enjoyable anymore.

Good afternoon,

i am the person who deals with event security for G6, unfortunately i have to disagree with your claims of certain factions getting special treatment, i have noted your number and dispatches, unfortunately i have a family and life outside the city and i try to get to people as i can, im not in the city before 1900 due to my child having my attention before that time.

I treat every client as if they are The Firm and everyone gets the same treatment, however i have not seen you or heard of you actually making contact other than the dispatch. and the dispatches are usually mid day, about 1830 and midnight, those hours are generally when G6 are inactive, as i said i had noted your dispatches and was going to try and make contact with you.

as for the mechanic shops i can confirm that most people who are working in the mechanic shops are more active in the evenings not during the day.

 

[crazycattxo]

Good afternoon,

i am the person who deals with event security for G6, unfortunately i have to disagree with your claims of certain factions getting special treatment, i have noted your number and dispatches, unfortunately i have a family and life outside the city and i try to get to people as i can, im not in the city before 1900 due to my child having my attention before that time.

I treat every client as if they are The Firm and everyone gets the same treatment, however i have not seen you or heard of you actually making contact other than the dispatch. and the dispatches are usually mid day, about 1830 and midnight, those hours are generally when G6 are inactive, as i said i had noted your dispatches and was going to try and make contact with you.

as for the mechanic shops i can confirm that most people who are working in the mechanic shops are more active in the evenings not during the day.

I've asked MULTIPLE individuals for support trying to contact, which I was told they knew people they could ask, etc etc. gone to multiple of your buildings etc. So I can assure you i have tried, a lot.

And yes, I am aware.

 

[crazycattxo]

Oh, I was told 10pm onwards, was when G6 was most active. So again, sorry. Was just told wrong information.

 

[Teej McGee]

i am the person who deals with event security for G6

 

[Bobinz]

I would just like to argue this point by saying why do we need a 42nd gang? Gangs come and go all the time, just today we saw 3 pack up shop for whatever reasons, it wont be long before another 3 start up right?

fortunately this required no dev input. Any one can press F6 and create a new gorup on the fly - good system wouldnt you think?

if/when those groups would be to be whitelistes.. that is another question. A question what will take time before even being asked.

but if I came to higher ups and said, okay I have a great idea for something I haven't seen yet but it requires admin/dev help with setting up, I'd get told to eat my own ass wouldn't I?

We have a suggestion thread in the forums for this. I wont answer for others, but that would defeat the objective of the suggestion thread

I can name so many businesses that started from nothing but the MLO and outsourcing food/kits.

Sadly, we cannot guarantee - nor force - people to stay here for long after being "given" something ("from the devs"); there is always that risk. We do, however, try to minimize it and make the most of our time.
Can you imagine working on something that gives you literally no interest, nor do you feel connected to the project at all - and all of that on a voluntary basis?

I think we deviated from the topic at hand.
Never stop posting suggestions, we do read those, we do take those in considerations when we do out changes here and there. Nothing happens in an instant.

 

[Nikolai]

I'm thinking more like support for opening businesses. It feels like we all get told no, because the highlight wants to be kept on certain current businesses. I wish we could all be given the same opportunities.

noone gets told no to open a business

In my opinion groups/gangs/factions shouldn't be able to own more than 1 business per gang to give others a chance. {Yes, of course if they've been around a very long time it may be a bit different, as long as it is fair which at the moment in some cases it doesnt feel so }

all current shops have been gained fairly, either due to length of time they've been on the server(Noble store is a good example) or simply due to giving a better proposal than others.

Theres a huge gap between whitelisted gangs/businesses then when people try to push to close that gap it gets denied.

we barely deny people on the idea of a new business, it's more a case of they bring it up to us, and then get burned out.
stuff takes the time it takes, Lang and Diaz(now Mirror Park Motors) took 16 months before they got a "official" business and not a roadside one.

There's no support for people who just want to roleplay their own work.

there's lots of support for those that do, BUT we can't also add a new business everytime runs a pop up shop in legion.

Great suggestions Kat, I'd like to see more opportunities to start business too, it would be great for roleplay too. If people have the motivation and want to create something we should definitely be given the means to do so to enrich the roleplay value on the server.

it's not that simple unfortunately, not that i don't agree.

I'm with you. I've always felt personally that if you're in a gang or group/faction then you should only be allowed to own 1 business between you

that's a though one, not every business owned by a gang member is owned by the gang, i can mention multiple that fall under such.

Can they work as a bin man and aspire to save up and own a business to be present in and RP or will they be outbid by Joe bloggs member of xyz gang who has 40 mil in his pocket?

that's not how it works.

Businesses should be for legal citizens not blatant criminals with large records.

i disagree, gangs need a "legal" way to "wash" their money, which is something buseinesses can provide for them if done right.
people have already been affected currently for not being careful.

Ok, so I did write that a bit wrong. I meant groups/factions as a whole, including gangs etc. Not specifically saying just gangs are owning more than 1 shop.

stating all factions is risky, as that includes police/nhs/g6 aswell, limiting alot of peoples main characters because they do something else aswell.

Definitely tweaking. I can think of 3 gangs that I know IN RP that have 2-3 businesses owned between their members

there's a difference between gangs owning and gang members owning

The simple answer to this is restaurants don't make enough money to be able to pay all of these people

this is also true, and more so affects any shop up north than down south.

It becomes "favoured" when people are asking for businesses in hopes to enrich their time within RPUK and are being told no because they become a competitor to those favoured businesses.

no shops are favoured, shops have been created for avenues that prior didn't have any competition

just not getting the opportunity because a gang/faction with a near infinite resource of money can outbit absolutely anyone.

not how it works.

Has someone being told by the CoC they can't attempt to start a business because "they already prefer another business"?

No, and if it has, it's a shame it hasn't been brought up at the time.

Mirror Park Motors,

Mirror Park Motors never got help from us tbf, other than taking over Lang and Diaz.

Literally as soon as we left suddenly, this faction now owns 3 that I know of in RP.

it didn't happen that quick

The easiest way to filter through who will run a business as a business in full RP terms is to comb over business proposals imo.

that already happens.

CoC, whichever are telling people starting businesses, that they aren't allowed to do certain things because it effects businesses,

that has never happened, we don't limit up and coming businesses in any way, other than telling them it'll take time and it's not certain it'll be a thing even then.

All we're asking is for EVERY business to have the same support, benefits etc. Ok, not so much the same for everyone.

every business has the same support/benefits, newer official ones will have a bit more as they are new.
others will have more restrictions for other reasons, all is discussed and coordinated with owners, so they don't get sneaked up on at some point about it.

from a development POV I think why? It will probably be denied, and so I've waisted all that time pushing for it. Because I enjoy it and want to see something come from it.

you'll always face hardships during the start of a business(especially a completely new one) that's how life works.
but by putting a stick in your front wheel while biking down a hill and to then go and blame the tree, you won't get very far with it.
i've seen your tweedle posts, keep going instead of quitting before even starting.

 

[Nikolai]

forgot to add.

same thing as Stavik stated, any more direct questions/concerns, feel free to tag me aswell, i'm the "head of it" so to speak prior to it going to project/dev/staff lead+

 

[MartinShipman11]

fortunately this required no dev input. Any one can press F6 and create a new gorup on the fly - good system wouldnt you think?

if/when those groups would be to be whitelistes.. that is another question. A question what will take time before even being asked.

We have a suggestion thread in the forums for this. I wont answer for others, but that would defeat the objective of the suggestion thread

I can name so many businesses that started from nothing but the MLO and outsourcing food/kits.

Sadly, we cannot guarantee - nor force - people to stay here for long after being given something (from the devs); there is always that risk. We do, however, try to minimize it and make the most of our time.
Can you imagine working on something that gives you literally no interest, nor do you feel connected to the project at all - and all of that on a voluntary basis?

I think we deviated from the topic at hand.
Never stop posting suggestions, we do read those, we do take those in considerations when we do out changes here and there. Nothing happens in an instant.

Oh please don't think I am discretting the work being done, I can totally understand your risk/reward needs to have a beneficial pay off for everyone involved.

i disagree, gangs need a "legal" way to "wash" their money, which is something buseinesses can provide for them if done right.
people have already been affected currently for not being careful.

this can be done in other ways other than just a gang owning a business, not saying the cannot own one, I think the point being made is if Jimmy approaches to buy a business and he’s got a shopping list of offences, or he’s known to be associated with people or gangs then he should have a black mark against his name.

that has never happened

This has happened, you know it has happened, rangers were told they were not allowed to be medically trained because it took away from NHS. Rangers were told they were not allowed to have a restraining ability because it took away from the police. Being told you are not allowed to do something because it steps on other factions toes has 100% happened

 

[Bmav]

I swear rangers have a very important business in holding the keys to the leather market which affects everyone on the server, don't know all the ins and outs of it but maybe you could focus on that market more.
As for rangers being medically trained i am also kinda of against it to some degree because i feel like NHS only really have one function on the server and if you ask me i think even police shouldn't be medically trained.

 

[Nikolai]

This has happened, you know it has happened, rangers were told they were not allowed to be medically trained because it took away from NHS. Rangers were told they were not allowed to have a restraining ability because it took away from the police. Being told you are not allowed to do something because it steps on other factions toes has 100% happened

given i replied to a comment about CoC, i'm unsure what rangers have of relevance, CoC have never done it to my knowledge, so i stand by my point

 

[MartinShipman11]

I swear rangers have a very important business in holding the keys to the leather market which affects everyone on the server, don't know all the ins and outs of it but maybe you could focus on that market more.
As for rangers being medically trained i am also kinda of against it to some degree because i feel like NHS only really have one function on the server and if you ask me i think even police shouldn't be medically trained.

Yes now. I am talking when the rangers were starting, suggestions were made to get that faction started and were all denied. I’m not associated with the rangers anymore, but I am using the experience we had as examples.

given i replied to a comment about CoC, i'm unsure what rangers have of relevance, CoC have never done it to my knowledge, so i stand by my point

then re-read the comment I made. I listed people who I believed made those decisions, take your pick which one makes that decision in that given circumstance I gave, if it isn’t CoC then clarify that it isn’t the CoC who makes those decisions and correct the information. What purpose does it serve self inserting the CoC if it isn’t the CoC who answers the queries I raised. The relevance being, people are still being capped with what they can do by whether or not it affects the neppy businesses. Whether it competes with them or in my example, aids them. You get pushed aside. This entire suggestions thread proves that, in when people make suggestions if they don’t benefit the neppy businesses everyone’s against it. Whether it’s Kats business today it will be someone else tomorrow who has to compete with gang run operations or neppy businesses that are protected by admins who have their fingers in those pies. It’s already an uphill battle to get something up and running without being given hurdles and roadblocks

 

[Astrid Belski]

I swear rangers have a very important business in holding the keys to the leather market which affects everyone on the server, don't know all the ins and outs of it but maybe you could focus on that market more.
As for rangers being medically trained i am also kinda of against it to some degree because i feel like NHS only really have one function on the server and if you ask me i think even police shouldn't be medically trained.

They do, that was implemented when we were command and still playing but it also lies with anyone who has a hunting license and aren't tied to the rangers in that sense. But I don't know where we're going with this
I think Martin was more referring to when we used to run the rangers we had asked for things that were categorically denied and were then actually added after we left, which is highlighting the OP's argument that there's bias and favoritism. Or rather, that's the impression it gives. It's very hard not to see it that way even if we're told that's not the case.

There is absolutely an attitude shift towards certain people/groups/factions on the server

Some = Stonewalled
Some = A plethora of opportunities

 

[Scott1994_]

Hey everyone! I posted a suggestion a while back, and after taking a short break, I’m back and wanted to share some of my thoughts again, plus a few new suggestions. I’ve definitely noticed some changes around the City, but honestly, not all of them have been for the better. The development updates have been awesome, no doubt, but there’s still this sense that things feel kind of divided when it comes to who gets what. Some groups or businesses seem to have more advantages than others. It’s also a little frustrating seeing so many people wanting to buy businesses around the city to bring more RP into the mix, especially buildings which aren't really opened or say a new business but getting told it’s not really an option. It feels like only one or two businesses get all the attention, while others don’t get the same opportunities or focus. And this extends to groups too. I know some might disagree, but everyone’s entitled to their opinion, right? I just wish the average person had more chances, and it wasn’t always the popular groups, individuals, or businesses that get the best of everything.

Here's some suggestions I'd love to see, to maybe try and stop this feeling of a divide.

More support for the average civilians
I feel there definitely needs to be more civ jobs, there's a total of about 4 jobs you can do. Perhaps a building job, or some interactive heists a few friends can do to pass the time. Of course with a cooldown. More support for character driven jobs, it's a roleplay server that relies on peer to peer interactions yet when people create peer to peer interactive jobs they get pushed back. I'm not talking about like "jobs" like bins, mechanic, delivery drivers I'm thinking more like support for opening businesses. It feels like we all get told no, because the highlight wants to be kept on certain current businesses. I wish we could all be given the same opportunities.

The Support of people opening business, I used to feel there was no support but what support can they do? you've got to proof by RP that you deserve things like we had to with Flywheels, we've earnt certain things, The issue is the business your maybe opening is something the government do not want more off. For instance Flywheels which i own we've been told that at the moment we will not be getting upgrades as the government do not want more than two working garages. Which personally i dont understand as there is no garages north but at the end of the day if starting a buissness is alla bout RP, We have grinded like other buissness and put events on so told be told that gutted bu you've done ti for a week

 

[crazycattxo]

The Support of people opening business, I used to feel there was no support but what support can they do? you've got to proof by RP that you deserve things like we had to with Flywheels, we've earnt certain things, The issue is the business your maybe opening is something the government do not want more off. For instance Flywheels which i own we've been told that at the moment we will not be getting upgrades as the government do not want more than two working garages. Which personally i dont understand as there is no garages north but at the end of the day if starting a buissness is alla bout RP, We have grinded like other buissness and put events on so told be told that gutted bu you've done ti for a week

The business has been around for longer than a week, but yes I do agree it is a grind And I mean, they haven't said they don't want more mechanics. They've just said right now, the focus is on the two they have, but where we provide different avenues from those two, I don't see why it cant be a thing one day

 

[MartinShipman11]

The Support of people opening business, I used to feel there was no support but what support can they do? you've got to proof by RP that you deserve things like we had to with Flywheels, we've earnt certain things, The issue is the business your maybe opening is something the government do not want more off. For instance Flywheels which i own we've been told that at the moment we will not be getting upgrades as the government do not want more than two working garages. Which personally i dont understand as there is no garages north but at the end of the day if starting a buissness is alla bout RP, We have grinded like other buissness and put events on so told be told that gutted bu you've done ti for a week

Answered your first question in a comment. What support can they do? You have a garage in the north, where not a lot of people go, if there was more things to do up north such as businesses that are regularly open and offer things you cannot get in the city = more traffic up north. To shut you down saying they don't want more than 2 working garages in the city is a bit of a ballache, if I were in your shoes I would be pissed off. They should work with you and say right what can we do to help you offer something that no one does in the city, not oh no you can do it if you want but you wont be a "business"